Christian Bands?

[Alkaline]

To love him and his creations? Christianity teaches us that nature' date=' that all other living things, should be at man's service. That he can do with them as he pleases.

And the Bible is used in the practice of christianity is it not? Used so as to bring God's word to others.[/quote']

Yeah, it is i'm not denying it. I'm just pointing out that practising christianity does not mean that you agree with all its edicts. I know plenty of christians who are not homophobic and who do not run around persecuting everyone. Just because its written down in a crusty old story book does not mean it's 'gospel' for want of a better phrase. Its not about rules and regulations man don't be so narrowminded, it's people like you that cause all the ill will in the world today.

You seem to have some sort of underlying hatred towards christianity and it's ideals, which is very prejudiced and not very punk.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Yeah' date=' it is i'm not denying it. I'm just pointing out that practising christianity does not mean that you agree with all its edicts. I know plenty of christians who are not homophobic and who do not run around persecuting everyone. Just because its written down in a crusty old story book does not mean it's 'gospel' for want of a better phrase. Its not about rules and regulations man don't be so narrowminded, it's people like you that cause all the ill will in the world today.

You seem to have some sort of underlying hatred towards christianity and it's ideals, which is very prejudiced and not very punk.[/quote']

As a christian you do not have to agree with all its edicts? So, folks can take whatever they please, rejecting whatever they believe is not convenient?

Yes, I do indeed despise the christian faith, and with good reason. And narrow minded? Why, coz I choose to express what I believe? Ill will? I say what I think.

Not very punk? Yes, punk does rail against discrimination. However, a lotta punks will not submit to a god. It conflicts with what they believe - that is a belief in freedom, and a rejection of authority. So, no contradiction is involved.

[Alkaline]

As a christian you do not have to agree with all its edicts? So' date=' folks can take whatever they please, rejecting whatever they believe is not convenient?

Yes, I do indeed despise the christian faith, and with good reason. And narrow minded? Why, coz I choose to express what I believe? Ill will? I say what I think.

Not very punk? Yes, punk does rail against discrimination. However, a lotta punks will not submit to a god. It conflicts with what they believe - that is a belief in freedom, and a rejection of authority. So, no contradiction is involved.[/quote']

Actually, yes. Faith is a personal thing, as is religion. Everybody takes something different from them. And yes, you are entitled to your own opinion. But why post such a confrontational statement if you didn't want someone to argue with. In your opinion religion has no place in punk or hardcore, but in mine it does- we can agree to disagree on that.

Out of interest, why do you despise the christian faith so much?

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Out of interest' date=' why do you despise the christian faith so much?[/quote']

I believe it a tool, one which can be used to control, to subjugate the people. It can, and is, used to control dissent.

We can affect change ourselves. We need no spiritual guidance. No god. Assistance ain't gonna come from above.

[Alkaline]

I believe it a tool' date=' one which can be used to control, to subjugate the people. It can, and is, used to control dissent.

We can affect change ourselves. We need no spiritual guidance. No god. Assistance ain't gonna come from above.[/quote']

I agree. All religion is used like that. Remember i'm not religious, i'm not advocating supression, control and subserviance. Read my posts man.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I agree. All religion is used like that. Remember i'm not religious' date=' i'm not advocating supression, control and subserviance. Read my posts man.

[/quote']

Hey man, no. I wasn't taking a pop at you.

[Alkaline]

Don't you agree that it isn't religion itself that is telling people to do these things, but a small percentage of people using religion to their own advantages, either in war or persecution etc?

I mean islamic and muslim teachings do not point to confrontation towards the western world and its ideals, but some people who practise the faith use it like that, and vice versa.

[psydoll]

i like low

they sound like christians

I'm wearing my Low t-shirt at the moment! Huzzah.

[KarmaTsunami]

i'm coming down on alkaline's side....i know plenty of christians...my mother for example....she's yet to murder me for my homosexuality. as is my brother come to think of it....

however people who twist the words of the bible....the old testament of which is irrelevant in todays world...to their own, neo-nazi conservative views dishearten me, sicken me, and disgust me.

[SensesWorkingOverTime]

Just gonna talk bout the punk/hardcore community. Christianity should have no place in it.

i dont understand you

i always thought the punk community (if there really is such a thing these days) was an INCLUSIVE community

to say that just because a person practises a faith they have no place in the punk/hardcore community is utterly stupid. Alkaline is right, faith is a personal thing, you can believe in everything the bible says straight up as fact or you can take the bits out you like and live by those. who the hell are you to say that the sense of god that religious people get out of their faith is wrong??

sure there have been way too many people abusing religion and using it to control people and suck them into the corrupt world but the underlying message of Christianity is a good one, and one not too dissimilar to the message of Punk. is it really so hard for you to accept that their could be some people out there making punk/hardcore music that have have a sense of God??

also, i remember a thread a while back where another user stated their love for Norma Jean. however, once you pointed out norma jean were a Christian band (who have next to no "preaching" content in their lyrics) the poster suddenly changed his opinion. i was flabbergasted, if you enjoy the MUSIC what the fuck does the religion of a band have to do with anything?!?!

no having a go or anything, man

p.s im not religious or a norma jean fan

[Demon Of The Fall]

im fairly Anti-Christian but Trouble are a great doom band and their stuff has strong christian lyrical content

[bryn]

Hmmm, lets just face it: in a business based around image, christianity is about as cool as your grannie.

[bryn]

im fairly Anti-Christian

what does this mean? are you a terrorist or something

[Sue Denim..]

It seems to come down to a 'ramming it down the listeners throat' thing.

E.g. Stryper sucked

Evanescence Rocks.

Keep the "J" word out of Christian rock and it seems to work.

Sue.

[Larsen B]

im fairly Anti-Christian but Trouble are a great doom band and their stuff has strong christian lyrical content

I hate when people talk about hatred between religions and but when a non-religious person says they hate a religion is usually okay. It is equally born out of ignorance. And Jesus was one of the coolest people ever, the original rebel and he actually had a good cause.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Don't you agree that it isn't religion itself that is telling people to do these things' date=' but a small percentage of people using religion to their own advantages, either in war or persecution etc?

I mean islamic and muslim teachings do not point to confrontation towards the western world and its ideals, but some people who practise the faith use it like that, and vice versa.[/quote']

I'm sorry but we're gonna have to agree to disagree. Sure, many have indeed sought to use religious belief to their advantage. But really there is no getting away from the fact that christianity does demand service - that to be a christian one must adhere to christ's teachings, and I just cannot go along with that.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I hate when people talk about hatred between religions and but when a non-religious person says they hate a religion is usually okay. It is equally born out of ignorance. And Jesus was one of the coolest people ever' date=' the original rebel and he actually had a good cause.[/quote']

Born of ignorance? Why? Coz I've chosen to reject such nonsense, such lies?

[The Milner]

I'm sorry but we're gonna have to agree to disagree. Sure' date=' many have indeed sought to use religious belief to their advantage. But really there is no getting away from the fact that christianity does demand service - that to be a christian one must adhere to christ's teachings, and I just cannot go along with that.[/quote']

But you follow a way of living based aroud your punk community yes? so therefore you are conforming to another way of living instead of cristianity. I know they are different one being a religion the other clearly not but the bottom line is the same.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

But you follow a way of living based aroud your punk community yes? so therefore you are conforming to another way of living instead of cristianity. I know they are different one being a religion the other clearly not but the bottom line is the same.

I follow a general code of beliefs yes. However, you cannot compare the leftist/anarchist politics of the punk community with a belief system built on oppression and lies. I seek freedom. Christianity teaches not freedom but service - service to a higher authority. I reject authority. Anarchists (of which I am one) ask that people take control of their own lives. I have no wish to thrust my beliefs on others with use of force if necessary. Sadly the same cannot be said of those of the christian faith. So, the bottom line is not the same.

[Doc]

I follow a general code of beliefs yes. However' date=' you cannot compare the leftist/anarchist politics of the punk community with a belief system built on oppression and lies. I seek freedom. Christianity teaches not freedom but service - service to a higher authority. I reject authority. So, the bottom line is not the same.[/quote']

You reject authority yet obey it nonetheless-or do you not buy things but steal them. Do you refuse to obey the law? Do you kill or assault those you don't like? No of course you don't, so you accept the authority of the law. My wife and her family are all baptists (although I'm agnostic) and a finer, nicer bunch of people you will never meet. Their view of christianity is not of subservience, but of tolerance and understanding, of non violence and charity and peace and love. In fact a several members of their congregation are recovering herion addicts, kicking their habit with the unconditional support of their church.

Their faith is simply a moral way of living and let living. To compare them with the US zealots is an insult and a display of ignorance, so profound as to be almost satanic.

[Larsen B]

I follow a general code of beliefs yes. However' date=' you cannot compare the leftist/anarchist politics of the punk community with a belief system built on oppression and lies. I seek freedom. Christianity teaches not freedom but service - service to a higher authority. I reject authority. So, the bottom line is not the same.[/quote']

Typical. While the different churches within christianity and indeed other religions may be somewhat corrupt, you are an ignoramus to say the belief system is built on oppression and lies. None of the major religions preach anything contrary to goodwill and certainly do not preach hatred or anything like as others including Alkaline have already stated. You seem to lack the capacity to fathom this. You're just concerned with disobeying authority. And i don't see how you can possibly discount the validity of different religious stand points on the basis that the leaders are a bit corrupt whilst you stand by your "leftist/anarchist politics". I mean it's not like you get corrupt politicians is it?

[Larsen B]

You reject authority yet obey it nonetheless-or do you not buy things but steal them. Do you refuse to obey the law? Do you kill or assault those you don't like? No of course you don't' date=' so you accept the authority of the law. My wife and her family are all baptists (although I'm agnostic) and a finer, nicer bunch of people you will never meet. Their view of christianity is not of subservience, but of tolerance and understanding, of non violence and charity and peace and love. In fact a several members of their congregation are recovering herion addicts, kicking their habit with the unconditional support of their church.

Their faith is simply a moral way of living and let living. To compare them with the US zealots is an insult and a display of ignorance, so profound as to be almost satanic.[/quote']

Nobody need say anymore.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

You reject authority yet obey it nonetheless-or do you not buy things but steal them. Do you refuse to obey the law? Do you kill or assault those you don't like? No of course you don't' date=' so you accept the authority of the law. My wife and her family are all baptists (although I'm agnostic) and a finer, nicer bunch of people you will never meet. Their view of christianity is not of subservience, but of tolerance and understanding, of non violence and charity and peace and love. In fact a several members of their congregation are recovering herion addicts, kicking their habit with the unconditional support of their church.

Their faith is simply a moral way of living and let living. To compare them with the US zealots is an insult and a display of ignorance, so profound as to be almost satanic.[/quote']

Before you take a swipe at me, I suggest firstly that you do some serious reading regarding my politics. Your point regarding my adherence to the law is complete nonsense, with no depth of understanding of what I'd actually said. Why should I wish to inflict physical harm? Why should I steal? Anarchism is not the law of the jungle as you believe - a thing which by the way I have corrected you on more than one occasion yet you have chosen to ignore. I seek freedom, and so respect others. I do not respect the law. I do not follow it blindly. Laws are made primarily to protect the interests of the established order. They are an instrument of control.

I agree, many christians are indeed good people. This however does not invalidate the main thrust of the arguement I've made - that is that the christian faith DOES demand obedience to a higher authority. And no, I did not compare those who are involved in charitable causes, who do good work, with the religious zealots found across the pond. I said nothing of the sort, so I shall ask you not to put words in to my mouth.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Typical. While the different churches within christianity and indeed other religions may be somewhat corrupt' date=' you are an ignoramus to say the belief system is built on oppression and lies. None of the major religions preach anything contrary to goodwill and certainly do not preach hatred or anything like as others including Alkaline have already stated. You seem to lack the capacity to fathom this. You're just concerned with disobeying authority. And i don't see how you can possibly discount the validity of different religious stand points on the basis that the leaders are a bit corrupt whilst you stand by your "leftist/anarchist politics". I mean it's not like you get corrupt politicians is it?[/quote']

Ignoramous? I resent your language. Hey, if you have not the skills to challenge my arguement and so have to resort to abuse, well, what can I say? It is my belief that the christian faith is indeed built on oppression and lies. Obedience is at its centre. To stray is a sin, and one that must be punished. No other belief should be considered.

And I said nothing of religious leaders. I've spoken only of the teachings themselves.

[jester1470]

Ignoramous? I resent your language. Hey' date=' if you have not the skills to challenge my arguement and so have to resort to abuse, well, what can I say? It is my belief that the christian faith is indeed built on oppression and lies. Obedience is at its centre. To stray is a sin, and one that must be punished. No other belief should be considered.

And I said nothing of religious leaders. I've spoken only of the teachings themselves.[/quote']

Actually i thought that Forgiveness was at the centre not obediance, there is the arguement that it is about repentance and seeing as the laws are generally moral and not religious then where's the harm. The bible is generally a way of people telling moral laws in its time, not really different from a selection of legal statues, so in that way its about obediance in the same way as following the law is as far as i can see.

Cheers

Stuart