Wind-up?

[unbroken]

Well quite a few folk in this thread have understood my arguments, written back with their own and generally discussed in a respectful manner. If you find these conversations akin to the nonsensically structured paragraphs generated there, then perhaps it isn't what is written that is at fault

no, we find YOUR "conversations" akin to this nonsensically structured paragraph.

[Rob_86]

Okay, let's do it. Let's build an inclusive, nondiscriminatory movement for social and political change. It may help if I begin my discussion by relating an innocuous story in order to illustrate my point: A few days ago I was arguing with a particularly brusque beggar who was insisting that the cure for evil is more evil. I tried to convince this tyrannical blatherskite that Mr. Rob must have recently made a huge withdrawal from the First National Bank of Lies. How else could he manage to tell us that unambitious ranters are all inherently good, sensitive, creative, and inoffensive? He does not tolerate any view that differs from his own. Rather, Mr. Rob discredits and discards those people who contradict him along with the ideas that they represent.

Imagine people everywhere embracing Mr. Rob's claim that it is better that a hundred thousand people should perish than that he should be even slightly inconvenienced. The idea defies the imagination. To use some computer terminology, Mr. Rob's Praetorian Guard has an "installed base" of hundreds of the most dissolute paper-pushers you'll ever see. The implication is that no matter what else we do, our first move must be to educate everyone about how Mr. Rob is our worst nightmare. That's the first step: education. Education alone is not enough, of course. We must also identify, challenge, defy, disrupt, and, finally, destroy the institutions that trivialize the issue.

Anyone who hasn't been living in a cave with his eyes shut and his ears plugged knows that Mr. Rob's op-ed pieces may have been conceived in idealism, but they quickly degenerated into snappish frotteurism. I never used to be particularly concerned about Mr. Rob's stances. Any damned fool, or so I thought, could see that Mr. Rob intends to create a new social class. Beer-guzzling, closed-minded scapegraces, debauched mob bosses, and sinister extremists will be given aristocratic status. The rest of us will be forced into serving as their brethren.

Mr. Rob's threats are just a rhetorical ploy to get away from the obvious fact that Mr. Rob's like the man behind the curtain in the Wizard of Oz. Pull back the curtain of solecism and you'll see an unsophisticated flimflammer hiding behind it, furiously pulling the levers of interventionism in a stinking attempt to replace Robert's Rules of Order with "facilitated consensus building" at all important meetings. That sort of discovery should make any sane person realize that we are observing the change in our society's philosophy and values from freedom and justice to corruption, decay, cynicism, and injustice. All of these "values" are artistically incorporated in one person: Rob.

I almost forgot: If a cogent, logical argument entered Mr. Rob's brain, no doubt a concussion would result. Time cannot change Mr. Rob's behavior. Time merely enlarges the field in which Mr. Rob can, with ever-increasing intensity and thoroughness, inaugurate an era of bilious, dishonest racialism. If my memory serves me correctly, I have a tendency to report the more sensational things that he is up to, the more shocking things, things like how he wants to pass off all sorts of dour and obviously treasonous stuff on others as a so-called "inner experience". And I realize the difficulty that the average person has in coming to grips with that, but he used to complain about being persecuted. Now Mr. Rob is our primary persecutor. This reversal of roles reminds me that I avoid execrable bludgers like the plague. Let's remember that. In closing this letter, let me point out that I would be remiss if I didn't remind you that Mr. Rob can't control his desire to have everything he wants and to have it now.

Look, if you don't have anything interesting to say start a new thread called 'things i like to cut and paste off the internet' and post there. Your desperation to be involved in this issue, by any, and I mean ANY means necessary is growing tiresome.

[Guest treader.]

no, we find YOUR "conversations" akin to this nonsensically structured paragraph.

Scott, you're a mate and everything, but just stop it.

[scottyboy]

Look, if you don't have anything interesting to say start a new thread called 'things i like to cut and paste off the internet' and post there. Your desperation to be involved in this issue, by any, and I mean ANY means necessary is growing tiresome.

There are some comments I need to make regarding Mr. Rob. The rest of this letter is focused exclusively on Mr. Rob, not because I harbor any ill-will towards him but because were he alive today, Hideki Tojo would be his most trustworthy ally. I can see Tojo joining forces with Mr. Rob to help him envelop us in a nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror.

Mr. Rob will pigeonhole people into predetermined categories because he possesses a hatred that defies all logic and understanding, that cannot be quantified or reasoned away, and that savagely possesses deceitful carpers with lecherous and uncontrollable rage. He coins polysyllabic neologisms to make his slogans sound like they're actually important. In fact, his treatises are filled to the brim with words that have yet to appear in any accepted dictionary. It is true that responsibility is an alien concept to Mr. Rob, but his functionaries' thinking is fenced in by many constraints. Their minds are not free because they dare not be.

If I am correctly informed, the wisdom that comes from maturation of the spirit, mind, and body will some day prevail over the idiocy of Mr. Rob's accusations. In any case, I overheard one of his faithfuls say, "Mr. Rob can override nature." This quotation demonstrates the power of language as it epitomizes the "us/them" dichotomy within hegemonic discourse. As for me, I prefer to use language to reveal the nature and activity of Mr. Rob's pals and expose their inner contexts as well as their ultimate final aims.

Mr. Rob has frequently been spotted making nicey-nice with the worst types of damnable grafters there are. Is this because he needs their help to rule with an iron fist? This is an important question because one of the things I find quite interesting is listening to other people's takes on things. For instance, I recently overheard some folks remark that besides being thoroughly offensive and abusive, his machinations are seriously defamatory. Excuse me; that's not entirely correct. What I meant to say is that the problem of hypocritical creeps serves as an excuse for Mr. Rob to express his own hostility and frustrated need for power. Regular readers of my letters probably take that for granted, but if I am to rally good-hearted people to the side of our cause, I must explain to the population at large that we must reach out to people with the message that there's something wrong with this picture. We must alert people of that. We must educate them. We must inspire them. And we must encourage them to name and shame his habitus for their putrid acts of Jacobinism.

Mr. Rob yields to the mammalian desire to assert individuality by attracting attention. Unfortunately, for Mr. Rob, "attract attention" usually implies "put a clog on all attempts to limit his power". If our eventual goal is to push a consistent vision that responds to most people's growing fears about the worst classes of perverted cutthroats I've ever seen, then we must consider various means to that end. Why can't he simply enjoy the fruits of his own labors and let other people enjoy the fruits of theirs? That's the question that perplexes me the most because if a cogent, logical argument entered his brain, no doubt a concussion would result.

This in mind, I would like to challenge Mr. Rob to defend his quips or else to change them. His personal attacks manifest themselves in two phases. Phase one: waste hours and hours of our time in fruitless conferences and meetings. Phase two: sell us fibs and fear mixed with a generous dollop of fetishism. Please forgive the following sermon, but it can't be avoided in this discussion: He ought to realize that the most valuable of all talents is that of never using two words when one will do. Unfortunately, Mr. Rob tends to utter so much verbiage about Trotskyism that I can conclude only that if he is going to promote a culture of dependency and failure, then he should at least have the self-respect to remind himself of a few things: First, what I take much more seriously than cheeky dunces are slaphappy peculators. And second, politically incorrect self-proclaimed arbiters of taste and standards are more susceptible to his brainwashing tactics than are any other group. Like water, their minds take the form of whatever receptacle Mr. Rob puts them in. They then lose all recollection that Mr. Rob demands obeisance from his torchbearers. Then, once they prove their loyalty, Mr. Rob forces them to engage in or goad others into engaging in illegal acts.

Whenever I turn around I see Mr. Rob plaguing our minds. To deny such a truth would be to deny the evidence of our own senses. Leaving aside the behavior of other immature crumbums, when I say that Mr. Rob's objectives are cantankerous, I mean it. I don't mean that they remind me of something cantankerous or that they have one or two cantankerous characteristics. I mean that they are cantankerous. In fact, the most cantankerous thing about them is the way that they prevent people from seeing that Mr. Rob wants us to believe that there's no difference between normal people like you and me and what I call improvident rotters. How stupid does he think we are? Here's the answer, albeit in a somewhat circuitous and roundabout style: I, speaking as someone who is not a larcenous grotesque-type, despise everything about him. I despise his attempts to use both overt and covert deceptions to poke and pry into every facet of our lives. I despise how he insists that there is an international Communist conspiracy to sap and impurify all of our precious bodily fluids. Most of all, I despise his complete obliviousness to the fact that he recently claimed that violence and prejudice are funny. I would have found this comment shocking had I not heard similar garbage from him a hundred times before.

What Mr. Rob doesn't realize is that he keeps telling everyone within earshot that radicalism can quell the hatred and disorder in our society. I'm guessing that Mr. Rob read that on some Web site of dubious validity. More reliable sources generally indicate that he has allowed himself to become a spokesman for the same point of view shared by coprophagous loudmouths, villainous big-labor bosses, and noisome chiselers while masquerading as an outspoken radical bucking the system. If there's an untold story here, it's that I receive a great deal of correspondence from people all over the world. And one of the things that impresses me about it is the massive number of people who realize that if we can understand what has caused the current plague of naive freeloaders, I believe that we can then create greater public understanding of the damage caused by his lamentations. Mr. Rob claims that the bogeyman is going to get us if we don't agree to his demands. Predictably, he cites no hard data for that claim. This is because no such data exist.

I indeed wouldn't want to use paid informants and provocateurs to leach integrity and honor from our souls. I would, on the other hand, love to counteract the subtle, but pervasive, social message that says that it is Mr. Rob's moral imperative to cause this country to flounder on the shoals of self-interest, corruption, and chaos. But, hey, I'm already doing that with this letter. Mr. Rob's protgs are often caught trying to produce a new generation of dictatorial, conceited schizophrenics whose opinions and prejudices, far from being enlightened and challenged, are simply legitimized. Of course, they deny this but we all know full well that Mr. Rob wants to manipulate public understanding of faddism. Personally, I don't want that. Personally, I prefer freedom. If you also prefer freedom then you should be working with me to make his grotty, self-satisfied witticisms understood, resisted, and made the object of deserved contempt by young and old alike.

Although the moral absolutist position is well represented by social and political activists and honestly influences legislators and policy makers, Mr. Rob's victims have been speaking out for years. Unfortunately, their voices have long been silenced by the roar and thunder of Mr. Rob's idolators, who loudly proclaim that Mr. Rob is a refined gentleman with the soundest education and morals you can imagine. Regardless of those crapulous proclamations, the truth is that if you were to try to tell his admirers that we need the space and autonomy to fight the bons mots that can hurt us, they'd close their eyes and put their hands over their ears. They are, as the psychologists say, in denial. They don't want to hear that I've heard of gin-swilling things like expansionism and Pyrrhonism. But I've also heard of things like nonviolence, higher moralities, and treating all beings as ends in and of themselvesideas which Mr. Rob's ignorant, unthinking, morally repugnant brain is too small to understand. Mr. Rob argues that laws are meant to be broken. To maintain this thesis, Mr. Rob naturally has had to shovel away a mountain of evidence, which he does by the desperate expedient of claiming that "metanarratives" are the root of tyranny, lawlessness, overpopulation, racial hatred, world hunger, disease, and rank stupidity. Let us now speak up and speak out against Mr. Rob because in that is our only hope for the future.

[Scootray]

Scott, you're a mate and everything, but just stop it.

Awww...that's considerate of you.

But not helping to defeat Rob. If you were a real friend, you'd crush Rob for him.

[Rob_86]

no, we find YOUR "conversations" akin to this nonsensically structured paragraph.

Please read my last post. Or at least attend a logic course or something - I know for a fact that the uni does formal logic, and at least used to do advanced logic - that might be a good start. Or keep pretending you have knowledge of how an argument might sound logical or not, when clearly it is your own views that can't be defended - to a degree where this sort of distraction has become useful in your own mind.

[unbroken]

Scott, you're a mate and everything, but just stop it.

huh? o_O

[The Kernel Loaf]

Blah blah blah blah

That's better.

[The Milner]

I have to agree with euan man, just leave it, if this thread bothers you so much dont read anymore of it, put rob on your ignore list and get on with things, the reason this keeps going on is because of everyone sticking up for the band so to speak, the guy has made his point in a very decent manor without resorting to insults unless provoked, your a much bigger and better person than to keep dragging this over and over.

[Guest treader.]

huh? o_O

as in: you are feeding the troll, not that you are the troll.

[unbroken]

fair dos.

[Bigsby]

Please read my last post. Or at least attend a logic course or something - I know for a fact that the uni does formal logic, and at least used to do advanced logic - that might be a good start. Or keep pretending you have knowledge of how an argument might sound logical or not, when clearly it is your own views that can't be defended - to a degree where this sort of distraction has become useful in your own mind.

[Scorge]

I have to agree with euan man, just leave it, if this thread bothers you so much dont read anymore of it, put rob on your ignore list and get on with things, the reason this keeps going on is because of everyone sticking up for the band so to speak, the guy has made his point in a very decent manor without resorting to insults unless provoked, your a much bigger and better person than to keep dragging this over and over.

I know what you're saying chief, but did you really expect more than a virtual game of piley-on-the-sandwich when the guy is being as persistently repetive/annoying/etc as he is?

not

[Guest Exposure @ Lemon Tree]

I reckon we should all pull together and find a hobby for Rob_86

[paranoid]

I reckon we should all pull together and find a hobby for Rob_86

Bungee-less bungee jumping!

[Rob_86]

I reckon we should all pull together and find a hobby for Rob_86

Perhaps 'scening' - a new hobby designed for members of online music scenes to jump on any new members in the vain attempt to make themselves look cool, whilst stopping the local music scene around you from growing. And yet eventually complaining that their club nights at music venues aren't as popular as they should be (the last bit is a glimpse into the future in case you didn't work it out)

[The Milner]

Perhaps 'scening' - a new hobby designed for members of online music scenes to jump on any new members in the vain attempt to make themselves look cool, whilst stopping the local music scene around you from growing. And yet eventually complaining that their club nights at music venues aren't as popular as they should be (the last bit is a glimpse into the future in case you didn't work it out)

dont start scene bashing, youve made a good point up to now but dont get dragged into the kids games.

[Scootray]

dont start scene bashing, youve made a good point up to now but dont get dragged into the kids games.

Thanks dad. Anymore words of wisdom?

[Guest Exposure @ Lemon Tree]

Perhaps 'scening' - a new hobby designed for members of online music scenes to jump on any new members in the vain attempt to make themselves look cool, whilst stopping the local music scene around you from growing. And yet eventually complaining that their club nights at music venues aren't as popular as they should be (the last bit is a glimpse into the future in case you didn't work it out)

That's just a pile of shit, and you know it. I haven't jumped on you cos you're a new member and didn't jump on you until you went all defensive because I merely disagreed with your opinion.

Get back in your box.

As for stopping the local music scene around me from growing, are you aware of how many local bands I'm giving the gig to at the Lemon Tree, and I'm managing/gig booking for a few local bands, to help them get tours/exposure around the UK. I have no idea on your background, but I'm guessing all you've done for the local music scene is slag off Wifebeater for about 100 posts.

[Frosty Jack]

Right, this thread is looking like it may be on its last legs. I'll give it a little bit longer to see if there's any decent debating left in it just to make sure though. The last few pages have been pretty embarrassing to be honest - if we can't get above that level, then the thread will be closed.

[Guest Exposure @ Lemon Tree]

I would just close it now if I was you. I don't think there's been anything meaningful said for about 30 pages

[The Milner]

Thanks dad. Anymore words of wisdom?

dont do drugs, drugs are bad.

[Scootray]

dont do drugs, drugs are bad.

Gotcha.

[Guest Exposure @ Lemon Tree]

dont do drugs, drugs are bad.

mmmmmmkaay

[The Kernel Loaf]

Haha, you have got to love the truth in Rob_86's little message he/she/it sent me:

"Wow, child rape what a hilarious subject. Why not make a band to offend said children? They're obviously too uptight if they don't find it funny. Grow up mate"

I just replied with "We did, so fuck you."