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GraemeC
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Does anyone know where the SNP position themselves politicaly? do they lean more to the left or the right?

If the SNP were to win a landslide victory at the next election...bear with me on this one... and Scotland was given its independance...you still there? stop laughing at the back...what would happen next?

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Does anyone know where the SNP position themselves politicaly? do they lean more to the left or the right?

Centre Left' date=' officially. My interpretation of the policies are of a Swedish-style Social Democratic ideology, but others might see it differently.

If the SNP were to win a landslide victory at the next election...bear with me on this one... and Scotland was given its independance...you still there? stop laughing at the back...what would happen next?

If the SNP gain power at the next election (a landside won't happen, the proportional representation system rules that out - the current administration only has a majority of 2 or 3, I think?) through an independence coalition, there'll be a referendum at some point during the administration's life on the issue.

If there's a yes vote, then I'm pretty sure the SNP have said that they would then negotiate with Westminister for the end of the union. Of course, this could easily erupt into a bloody civil war - especially as London has the power to repeal the Scotland Act at any moment. If London allowed it, then I suspect it would be a gradual withdrawal to ensure that EU membership didn't get broken and so on.

After that : I suspect Scotland would follow the Norwegian/Swedish/Danish example of high taxation but high income/good welfare state. It depends though, on just how much natural resources are left.

My money's on the UK becoming a confederation, though.

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Most (not all) of the people I've met who vote for them are racist cunts' date=' so I'm guessing the party itself is right wing.[/quote']

Wrong. Considering that the SNP make quite a lot of noise about immigration being needed in Scotland, they're probably one of the least racist parties out there.

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Wrong. Considering that the SNP make quite a lot of noise about immigration being needed in Scotland' date=' they're probably one of the least racist parties out there.[/quote']

See, that's what confuses me. While the politicians might rightly say that immigration is needed, many SNP voters I've met have been small minded anti-immigration types.

As for Scotland leaving the Union, it would find it hard to balance the books. If you wanna drag oil into it, it;s not Scottish oil, it's British oil, so you can't guarantee on that for income. Besides, production peaked years ago. I can't see there being a bloody civil war breaking out over it, I;m not sure if people are that bothered about it.

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Cloud....do you know how many seats they currently occupy at Hollyrood?

26 at the minute' date=' out of 129. It might be better to look at it from an independence-bloc point of view though, which (at the minute) would likely be the following -

Scottish National Party - 26

Scottish Green Party - 7

Scottish Socialist Party - 6

Independents - 2

So 44 out of 129 at the minute would be definitely pro-independence. I think it's broadly in line with how many people support full independence - but I can't find any figures to actually suggest how big the independence vote would be.

And what kind of numbers of snp voters would there be nationally?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_parliamentary_election%2C_2003

It's probably safe to say that the current electoral system isn't really proportionate at all.

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If there's a yes vote' date=' then I'm pretty sure the SNP have said that they would then negotiate with Westminister for the end of the union. Of course, [b']this could easily erupt into a bloody civil war - especially as London has the power to repeal the Scotland Act at any moment. If London allowed it, then I suspect it would be a gradual withdrawal to ensure that EU membership didn't get broken and so on.

some good points in your post... but the civil war nonsense is hair brained..... a majority of scots voted yes in the 70's for independence...however... there was a fairly dodgy proviso put into effect (notably that flies in the face of democracy) that was that 40% of the scottish electorate had to vote yes...37 point something did... and independence was lost for the time being..... notably a good number of those on the electoral role were dead etc etc and the whole thing was deemed a bit dubious "bratania waves the rules" as i recall...however...bloody civil war???

eh no....not at all....

where did you get that idea?

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See' date=' that's what confuses me. While the politicians might rightly say that immigration is needed, many SNP voters I've met have been small minded anti-immigration types.[/quote']

I've met the same from Liberal Democrat voters, Labour voters and Conservative voters. The problem is that the SNP flies the nationalist flag, and as such, attracts the nationalist vote - which includes the undesirable types. I'm sure the Greens get people voting for them that they don't want anything to do with, too. Same with all parties, really...but a vote's a vote.

As for Scotland leaving the Union, it would find it hard to balance the books. If you wanna drag oil into it, it;s not Scottish oil, it's British oil, so you can't guarantee on that for income. Besides, production peaked years ago.

Read into Rockall and you'll see why England won't give up Scotland easily. It's not proven at all, but potentially, Rockall could represent a lot of money in the future. Anyway, the concept of "British" oil wouldn't exist if Britain ceased to exist - the boundaries would be drawn according to international law.

And...Scotland regularly contributes more than it gets out, so why would it find it hard to balance the books?

I can't see there being a bloody civil war breaking out over it, I;m not sure if people are that bothered about it.

I wouldn't be terribly surprised, given that Glasgow mirrors Belfast at times.

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As for Scotland leaving the Union' date=' it would find it hard to balance the books. If you wanna drag oil into it, it;s not Scottish oil, it's British oil, so you can't guarantee on that for income. Besides, production peaked years ago. I can't see there being a bloody civil war breaking out over it, I;m not sure if people are [i']that bothered about it.

just an observation, not a corner stone of any argument, but consider this...

scotland is the 10th largest oil producer in the world (could be the 11th) kuwait is placed behind scotland by a single place... let me assure you the standard of living for a first class Kuwaiti citizen is very different to that of your average scottish citizen...

the real need for independence was underlined during thatchers reign...here, scotland voted labour primarily, however was inflicted with a right wing short termist conservative govt for three elections in a row... scotland suffered considerably and seemingly could do nothing about it....

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some good points in your post... but the civil war nonsense is hair brained..... a majority of scots voted yes in the 70's for independence...however... there was a fairly dodgy proviso put into effect (notably that flies in the face of democracy) that was that 40% of the scottish electorate had to vote yes...37 point something did... and independence was lost for the time being..... notably a good number of those on the electoral role were dead etc etc and the whole thing was deemed a bit dubious "bratania waves the rules" as i recall...however...bloody civil war???

Wasn't an independence vote, it was a vote for devolution - and if my understanding is right, it wasn't a good offer anyway. If there had been a yes vote, I suspect Thatcher would've stripped the devolved parliament of its powers anyway.

If you find the civil war theory hard to understand, put it this way..do you think, in the event of a close independence win, that the other part are going to accept it, particularly the ones with a lot of interests in the continuation of the Union? Think about Glasgow - are committed "RULE BRITANNIA" types going to lie down and accept the fact that the union is going to be dissolved? I doubt it.

I'm trying to think of examples in the last 20-30 years where independence hasn't been bloody in some sense. The Czech Republic and Slovakia comes to mind..but look at the amount of blood spilled elsewhere at the start of the 90's over independence?

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Wasn't an independence vote' date=' it was a vote for devolution - and if my understanding is right, it wasn't a good offer anyway. If there had been a yes vote, I suspect Thatcher would've stripped the devolved parliament of its powers anyway. [/quote']

i dont think thatch was in power at that time..in fact im sure she wasnt... once the ball got rolling it might not have been to easy for her to realize her objectives whenshe did...but that is merely conjecture

If you find the civil war theory hard to understand' date=' put it this way..do you think, in the event of a close independence win, that the other part are going to accept it, particularly the ones with a lot of interests in the continuation of the Union? Think about Glasgow - are committed "RULE BRITANNIA" types going to lie down and accept the fact that the union is going to be dissolved? I doubt it.[/quote']

illegality would simply land them in trouble with the rozzers and a long spell in the slammer....

I'm trying to think of examples in the last 20-30 years where independence hasn't been bloody in some sense. The Czech Republic and Slovakia comes to mind..but look at the amount of blood spilled elsewhere at the start of the 90's over independence?

if you are refering to the balkans... you have to agree there is a world of differnce between titos yugoslavia and the united kingdom.... and where were all the bloody civil war enthusiasts after develoution was gained?

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26 at the minute' date=' out of 129. It might be better to look at it from an independence-bloc point of view though, which (at the minute) would likely be the following -

Scottish National Party - 26

Scottish Green Party - 7

Scottish Socialist Party - 6

Independents - 2

So 44 out of 129 at the minute would be definitely pro-independence. I think it's broadly in line with how many people support full independence - but I can't find any figures to actually suggest how big the independence vote would be.

[url']http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_parliamentary_election%2C_2003

It's probably safe to say that the current electoral system isn't really proportionate at all.

Bloody hell thats an eye opener... snp get 1/2 million votes and gain 9 seats and the lib dems get 1/4 million votes and get 13 seats.... now theres a case for proportional representation if ever I saw one...

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Bloody hell thats an eye opener... snp get 1/2 million votes and gain 9 seats and the lib dems get 1/4 million votes and get 13 seats.... now theres a case for proportional representation if ever I saw one...

it was worse in the '80s dude.... 25% to 30% (or so) of scottish electorate vote snp.... 5 seats in uk parliament... (out of 80 odd in scotland..if my fading memory serves me well/ at all :o/ )....

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I, being from england, automatically connected the SNP with the BNP (stupidly, i know) and maybe this is where the impression that racists vote for the SNP come from, as this is the general opinon of BNP voters.

What are the SNP's main policies (apart from Scotish independence)?

Also - this is quite interesting to do:

http://www.politicalcompass.org/

don't know if it's been posted before...

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Does anyone know where the SNP position themselves politicaly? do they lean more to the left or the right?

If the SNP were to win a landslide victory at the next election...bear with me on this one... and Scotland was given its independance...you still there? stop laughing at the back...what would happen next?

The first thing that would happen would be I would pack my bags and move out of a country that's about to sink quite quickly.

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The first thing that would happen would be I would pack my bags and move out of a country that's about to sink quite quickly.

Would you fuck! Stop speaking bollocks you lazy bastard.

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Wrong. Considering that the SNP make quite a lot of noise about immigration being needed in Scotland' date=' they're probably one of the least racist parties out there.[/quote']

The SNP are definitelly not a racist party and have far more left-wing views on immigration than most parties.

On the field of indpendence, look at the Scandinavian countries which are of a similar size and with similar natural resources which have positively flourished since gaining Independence with some of the best quality of living and the ability to fully reap the rewards of their natural resources.

Then consider there are areas in Glasgow with a life expectancy roughly equivalent to those in Bangladesh, I think the SNP make a pretty good case for Independence. Then again, I'm worried that it could be past the point where it could make any significant difference in Scotland.

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