Is it finally the end for The Lemon Tree?

[dougfast]

read in the paper that they were considering using the place opposite the train station as the "new" lemon tree sort of style place* (cant remember the name it begins witha "T" though.)

*which i mean goverment funded arts, music, theartre, etc

[shaun]

read in the paper that they were considering using the place opposite the train station as the "new" lemon tree sort of style place* (cant remember the name it begins witha "T" though.)

*which i mean goverment funded arts' date=' music, theartre, etc[/quote']

tivoli theatre?

[Graeme]

read in the paper that they were considering using the place opposite the train station as the "new" lemon tree sort of style place* (cant remember the name it begins witha "T" though.)

*which i mean goverment funded arts' date=' music, theartre, etc[/quote']

You're mixing up two seperate stories. The council are looking to build a new purpose built Lemon Tree and are not willing to fund the redevelopment of The Tivoli Theatre.

[GraemeC]

You're mixing up two seperate stories. The council are looking to build a new purpose built Lemon Tree and are not willing to fund the redevelopment of The Tivoli Theatre.

No....there was a story in the EE that suggested the Tivoli could be the new Lemon Tree, but we all know the pish that Aberdeen journals publish.

[Cloud]

No....there was a story in the EE that suggested the Tivoli could be the new Lemon Tree' date=' but we all know the pish that Aberdeen journals publish.[/quote']

Out of curiosity, what would be the likely capacity of the Tivoli if it was used?

Perhaps the council could build the new Lemon Tree on the site of Union Square, seeing as that project needs a firm kick up the arse.

[Graeme]

Have a look http://www.chem.gla.ac.uk/%7Egbarr/cinemas/scotland/aberdeen/Pages/14.html

It would very much be a Theatre space if refurbished.

[ragudave]

Have a look http://www.chem.gla.ac.uk/%7Egbarr/cinemas/scotland/aberdeen/Pages/14.html

It would very much be a Theatre space if refurbsihed.

yes its a little steep for a gig venue... Unless Fishbone are playing,

Dave

[thegossip]

evening express /p&j lemon tree stories

has anyone ready the p&j today or last nights evening express?

i love to say ....... i told you so!

[Scootray]

Wow, thanks for telling us what's in it. Elaborate please.

[framheim]

it's taken them a while to pick up on that story though, that report which it's based on has been on the go for ages. i don't like the way the LT chairman assumes the council will keep pick up the slack either.

http://www.thisisnorthscotland.com/displayNode.jsp?nodeId=149235&command=displayContent&sourceNode=149218&contentPK=14562896&moduleName=InternalSearch&formname=sidebarsearch

it'd be a shame if it closed but it's not a charity.

what's happening to the arts council? it says in that story it's being disbanded in two years time. anything replacing it?

[thegossip]

Sac

yes SAC and Scottish Screen are amalgamating to form a new all powerful organisation with more money. they will no longer have to fund the "big 5" national companies as these will get money direct from the scottish exec. so should have more cash available.

[Scootray]

it's taken them a while to pick up on that story though' date=' that report which it's based on has been on the go for ages. i don't like the way the LT chairman assumes the council will keep pick up the slack either.[/quote']

Yeah, the LT chairman thinks it's all fine.

"The council would not allow the Lemon Tree to close - it has helped keep us going in the past"

And look how far that got them, they're losing money that necessarily doesn't have to be lost. I think the LT chairman should think about what he just said and realise that he can't depend on the taxpayer for his inability to run a stable organisation.

[soundian]

what's happening to the arts council? it says in that story it's being disbanded in two years time. anything replacing it?

"In January 2006 it was announced that the Scottish Executive will assume direct responsibility for the main national arts companies (Scottish Opera, Scottish Ballet, Royal Scottish National Orchestra, Scottish Chamber Orchestra) and that the Arts Council is to be replaced by a new body to be called Creative Scotland."

[Chris]

yes SAC and Scottish Screen are amalgamating to form a new all powerful organisation with more money. they will no longer have to fund the "big 5" national companies as these will get money direct from the scottish exec. so should have more cash available.

unless Creative Scotland's budget miraculously reduces by about the same amount that the big 5 used to get from SAC

[french_disko]

did everyone read yesterday's Evening Express story?

http://www.aberdeen-music.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35915

[Jim Stax]

SAC new funding regime.

" Foundation organisations [foundation funding as mentioned earlier will replace core funding], some of which are recieving dramatic uplifts in annual funding, will be gauranteed funding for a period of five years. In return they will be required to reach pre-determined targets [...] funding for foundation organisations will increase by approximately $4m to £14m. Forty organisations, ranging in scale [...] will recieve flexible funding and effectivley have their current funding status and commitments maintained. Fifteen organisations including [...] The Lemon Tree in Aberdeen, which previously recieved regular funding, will now only be able to apply for project funding."

The 'project funding' does not state that a high level of funding is not available, but instead, may be recieved on production of sufficient project by project applications laid out on in the guidlines for any funding app. The intent is to encourage correct management of funds and an organistaion thus ensure that a 'vision' is made manifest and that relevant targets are set, attained and surpassed. Essentially a kick up the arse and not an end.

Maintaining an equilibrium in a business and developing a 'vision for the future' I would consider to be two seperate tasks... This could be a positive step for Aberdeen (bigger picture)

Jim

[senseless]

it'd be a shame if it closed but it's not a charity.

The Lemon Tree is and always has been a charity.

[framheim]

The Lemon is and always has been a charity.

no it's not, it's a council funded arts centre.

[Jim Stax]

The Lemon is and always has been a charity.

Ltd Company (with charitable status?)

[Cloud]

Ltd Company (with charitable status?)

Limited by Guarantee' date=' it would seem. Basically, they don't have share capital and can't distribute profits. Can't remeber off hand what the rules are for when the company is wound up, but I *think* they have to give the money to others with a similar aim.

Also according to the OSCR, they're a charity too - [url']http://www.oscr.org.uk/CharityIndexDetails.aspx?id=20844

I presume (though could be completely wrong) that there's a distinction between the charitable work that the Lemon Tree carries out and the profit making side of things. I might put a FoI request into the council to ask about the distinction..

It's a shame that someone doesn't open a small venue along the same lines of the Lemon Tree.

Interestingly, the LT's accounts are late for this year. You'd think they'd manage to get something as simple as their annual accounts in on time.

Perhaps it's time to split the Lemon Tree up? Use the profits from the Lemon Tree (run as a business) to subsidise a smaller venue elsewhere for the arts, with some sort of arrangement to use the Lemon Tree for bigger, more profitable productions? I'm no expert, but I dare say the Lemon Tree suffers from having to accomodate everything.

I don't think we'll see any movement until after May next year, though.

[jalepeano death]

I wonder if the council could use this 350 000 better.

Some of it could be used to subsidise rates for a selection of suitable private sector venues in Aberdeen. Perhaps venues could appeal for a rates reduction if they spent the money on improving their sound and lighting equipment.

The rest of this money could be used to fund a selection of festivals and events in these venues that may lose money but are important to bring to Aberdeen.

Rather than the council competing with privatley owned venues they would be helping them. I think this would be much better value for money for us. It could be like having 10 lemon trees all with there own personality suitable for a much wider variety of acts.

[Cloud]

I wonder if the council could use this 350 000 better.

Some of it could be used to subsidise rates for a selection of suitable private sector venues in Aberdeen. Perhaps venues could appeal for a rates reduction if they spent the money on improving their sound and lighting equipment.

Problem is' date=' it's not so much the sound and lighting equipment that's the problem. Look at most venues here, they have modern lighting and sound equipment that does the job fine. I also suspect there would be an outrage if the Lemon Tree was closed to subsidise private enterprise - and given that the council is facing an election next year, there's no way that they're going to dare to push such a measure through when they don't have a huge majority on the council.

The rest of this money could be used to fund a selection of festivals and events in these venues that may lose money but are important to bring to Aberdeen.

Rather than the council competing with privatley owned venues they would be helping them. I think this would be much better value for money for us. It could be like having 10 lemon trees all with there own personality suitable for a much wider variety of acts.

Would it really be better value for money, though? Private enterprise would have to make their profit - so you'd be looking at having to pay even more just to maintain the current level of loss making events, which is hardly value for money. The Lemon Tree can afford (well, can't afford at the minute, but) to put on loss making events because they make money from other things.