Guest Bob Double Jack Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 Glasgow - Friday 21st October 2005Anyone going?(gasp.....cue discussion / statements / arguments on how crap and dull Vai, Satriani, etc are, how could anyone enjoy them, etc) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hog Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 Sounds tempting but I will get very jealous if I see him play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Ghost Of Fudge Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 (gasp.....cue discussion / statements / arguments on how crap and dull Vai' date=' Satriani, etc are, how could anyone enjoy them, etc) [/quote']ok i saw vai supporting aerosmith, like, ten years ago in glasgow. devin townsend was singing. it was a dreadful, turgid set. and one of my all-time 'awful' shows.still, eh, each their own... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Double Jack Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 ok i saw vai supporting aerosmith' date=' like, ten years ago in glasgow. devin townsend was singing. it was a dreadful, turgid set. and one of my all-time 'awful' shows.still, eh, each their own...[/quote']sex and religion was hoop of the highest order - i think vai was responsible for "discovering" devin townsend. Thats one thing not to good about him then. hopefully not too much singing at this gig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AmbientMood Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 I'll be living in Glasgow then so I reckon this a definate yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hog Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 Townsend hated his time singing for Vai. It worked for and against him. He made enough money to start his own solo career but also a lot of people will think that he writes song like Vai (nothing like him).Devy found the Vai shows very boring, so he would play naked and stick things up his bum Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fast Caz Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 Ahhhh i see where you get it from Hog ( refering to sticking things up your bottom) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the_beastly_one Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 I'd love to see this gig, but I doubt I'd find anyone else willing to go, so it'll probably be out of the question. I'd go alone if I was a huge fan, but I'm not THAT much into Vai. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest She-Wolf Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 Im in the same position, Id love to go but dont know any other Vai fans. Id love to go see him.....so beautiful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Maverik Posted August 2, 2005 Report Share Posted August 2, 2005 Man, I really can't understand Vai fans. I mean he has an occasional stroke of genius (The Animal, Fire Garden, Tender Surrender spring to mind) but most of his stuff (IMO) is unlistenable wank. Satch is guilty of it as well, but not half as much. I like a strong sense of melody in Guitar instrumentals. Anyone tried anything along the lines of: Marty Friedman, Andy Timmons, Steve Morse?Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AmbientMood Posted August 3, 2005 Report Share Posted August 3, 2005 Man' date=' I really can't understand Vai fans. I mean he has an occasional stroke of genius (The Animal, Fire Garden, Tender Surrender spring to mind) but most of his stuff (IMO) is unlistenable wank. Satch is guilty of it as well, but not half as much. I like a strong sense of melody in Guitar instrumentals. Anyone tried anything along the lines of: Marty Friedman, Andy Timmons, Steve Morse?Andy[/quote']Personally I find within the genre-of-instrumental-guitar-that-isn't-jazz, Steve Vai the most interesting, innovative person to listen to whereas Satriani to be the boring 'melodic lines' over dull chord progressions.Satch however does pull off some nice things on stage and 'Ice #9' is fucking ace. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted August 3, 2005 Report Share Posted August 3, 2005 I hugely enjoy the Dave Lee roth stuff Steve Vai plays on. Yankee Rose even has an absurb attempt at Vai's guitar "talking" to Dave at the start! Stunt guitarist, aye. No less fun for that. I'm sure it would be exciting to watch live. The lack of tuneage may make it drag on for a bit, but if you're into that sort of thing........... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Maverik Posted August 4, 2005 Report Share Posted August 4, 2005 Personally I find within the genre-of-instrumental-guitar-that-isn't-jazz' date=' Steve Vai the most interesting, innovative person to listen to whereas Satriani to be the boring 'melodic lines' over dull chord progressions.Satch however does pull off some nice things on stage and 'Ice #9' is fucking ace.[/quote']I didn't say I love Satch, I just find him more listenable. And does innovative mean playing dissonant chord sequences while fret wanking over the top? Try some Marty Friedman, or Andy Timmons. Both offer a good mix of originality and melodic sensibilities - Friedman especially.Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Maverik Posted August 4, 2005 Report Share Posted August 4, 2005 I've got a video from 1981 of Vai and Frank Zappa having a guitar "duel". Vai's gurning' date=' posing, wailing out every note that is technically possible, and Zappa just stands there, playing over him, and playing one of the greatest guitar solos I've ever heard. Eventually Vai gives up, kneels in front of FZ and studies his hands intently. At the end, Vai regains a bit of cockiness, goes to the front of the stage and weedlie-wees with his tongue sticking out. Zappa turns his back and brings the band down behind him. A triumph of substance over style.Never again did Zappa hire a "stunt guitarist" for his touring band.I could never understand why anyone would want to listen to a Steve Vai solo record. There's no passion, no essential energy, in what he does. Sure, guitarists who play in that style may glean something from his technique, but it makes for godawful listening for the rest of us.[/quote']Well said that man! Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted August 4, 2005 Report Share Posted August 4, 2005 Never again did Zappa hire a "stunt guitarist" for his touring band.Vai wasn't just a stunt guitarist hired for one tour with zappa. he was a part of the band for a number of years and played on a number of zappa albums. http://www.djnoble.demon.co.uk/ints/STEVEVA.ION.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NARC Posted August 4, 2005 Report Share Posted August 4, 2005 He played as a session guitarist for PiL too, I believe. Come to think of it, there are some crazy guitar parts on "Ship Arriving Too Late...", never realised some of it could be Vai. Arf! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AmbientMood Posted August 5, 2005 Report Share Posted August 5, 2005 For decent guitar players, doubting Vai is like doubting cancer research. He's the guitar scientist. No one fully understands the guitar from so many different angles as him. Thinking he is just a wanky player is just ignorance through the stigma associated with him - I love Zappa as much as the next guy, more even, but theres no denying he is far wankier a soloist than vai. Disbelieve it, then go back through your record archive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Maverik Posted August 5, 2005 Report Share Posted August 5, 2005 For decent guitar players' date=' doubting Vai is like doubting cancer research. He's the guitar scientist. No one fully understands the guitar from so many different angles as him. Thinking he is just a wanky player is just ignorance through the stigma associated with him - I love Zappa as much as the next guy, more even, but theres no denying he is far wankier a soloist than vai. Disbelieve it, then go back through your record archive.[/quote']Balls to that. Vai is technically amazing - agreed, Vai has a vast knowledge of musical theory and the workings of the Guitar - agreed, Vai composes music which is pleasant to the ear - Sorry man, but I've heard plenty of Vai and most of it is wanky shit. Yes there are some sparks of absolute genius inbetween, but not many. Doubting Vai is like doubting an extended warranty from Dixons - Jusitified!!Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hog Posted August 5, 2005 Report Share Posted August 5, 2005 Vai once stated that he was jealous of Devin Townsend's genius, as far as Im concerned, that is me happy, fuck the rest of you (kidding...sort of) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AmbientMood Posted August 5, 2005 Report Share Posted August 5, 2005 Vai composes music which is pleasant to the ear - Not that I ever claimed easy listening was a trait of his, yet since you brought it up I recommend 'the boy from seattle,' for you to hear real guitar playing and tone that sends me to sleep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gregor Ascension Posted August 7, 2005 Report Share Posted August 7, 2005 Vai is one of the best guitar players ever. HE IS NOT A SHREDDER. he is innovative, original, even invented his own scale! he has the best phrasing technique in the world and his approach to the guitar is something special (Bulgarian wedding music, need i say more?)i accept that his solo albums are not for everyone (hell, i couldnt sit down and listen to them), but you cant deny his musical genius. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Zeenat Aman Posted August 7, 2005 Report Share Posted August 7, 2005 Vai is one of the best guitar players ever. HE IS NOT A SHREDDER. he is innovative' date=' original, even invented his own scale! he has the best phrasing technique in the world and his approach to the guitar is something special (Bulgarian wedding music, need i say more?)i accept that his solo albums are not for everyone (hell, i couldnt sit down and listen to them), but you cant deny his musical genius.[/quote']My opinion is...Virtuoso - yes.Genius - No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mick Maverik Posted August 7, 2005 Report Share Posted August 7, 2005 Vai is one of the best guitar players ever. HE IS NOT A SHREDDER. he is innovative' date=' original, even invented his own scale! he has the best phrasing technique in the world and his approach to the guitar is something special (Bulgarian wedding music, need i say more?)i accept that his solo albums are not for everyone (hell, i couldnt sit down and listen to them), but you cant deny his musical genius.[/quote']Yes you can, I just did. Yeah, he isn't a shredder, but he IS a fret wanker. His phrasing technique is great, but not for everyone, and there are plenty of other players which could match it. His approach to music is obscure and largely lacks melody. I agree that he has some moments, but most of his stuff is, to me, nothing more than technical music theory (which anyone could learn if they wanted), applied in a wanky, flashy format. To me Vai is someone who has achieved a lot through hard graft and some luck, but melody is not something which comes to him naturally like some more gifted players..Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Gregor Ascension Posted August 7, 2005 Report Share Posted August 7, 2005 Yes you can' date=' I just did. Yeah, he isn't a shredder, but he IS a fret wanker. His phrasing technique is great, but not for everyone, and there are plenty of other players which could match it. His approach to music is obscure and largely lacks melody. I agree that he has some moments, but most of his stuff is, to me, nothing more than technical music theory (which anyone could learn if they wanted), applied in a wanky, flashy format. To me Vai is someone who has achieved a lot through hard graft and some luck, but melody is not something which comes to him naturally like some more gifted players..Andy[/quote']i agree with alot that you have said, but the "wanky format" issue is all wrong. it is what it is - guitar music, and if you dont like the musicianship, go listen to some girls aloud or something.. can you suggest any other guitar player who has the phrasing ability that is unique like vai's? i can only think of marty friedman. vai's playing is original and trys to draw influence from unorthodox approaches to the guitar. he has lots of wierd melodies in his music, but trys to create something unusal such as his new album. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AmbientMood Posted August 7, 2005 Report Share Posted August 7, 2005 can you suggest any other guitar player who has the phrasing ability that is unique like vai's? i can only think of marty friedman.Ermm in terms of phrasing' date=' Montegomery, Benson, Django, Lang, Kessel (kassel?), Mcglaughin, Holdsworth all have great phrasing. In fact plenty of players have better 'phrasing' than Marty Friedman, who is pretty much another heavy metal diddly-diddly-diddly player no? Go up to Beans on Saturdays or Kef on Thursdays for home-grown quality soloing! To me Vai is someone who has achieved a lot through hard graft and some luckIn terms of saying anyone can understand theory if they wanted to though... thats bullshit. Thats like saying anyone could understand quantum physics. Also, quantum physics, like theory requires graft - would you suggest Steven Hawkins not a genius because he worked like bastard to get to his level of knowledge?? There really is soooo much to take in before you can solo well over chord progressions, make interesting and spontaneous chord choices etc etc. In Vai's case, his impro is sometimes pretty balls, but he isn't selling himself on improvisation. His musical creativity, strengthened by a very substantial amount of knowledge, is very impressive, even when he's chugging out a heavy riff.I don't know where 'luck' comes into it. Zappa said that he couldn't say no to Vai as he auditioned through a phone call. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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