Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 For starters, as I a) Ca be arsed and b) You could argue about this till the cows come home.All of them play music that isn't a 2 minute love song or short rock n roll song. The Beatles invented music that wasn't 2 minute love songs or short rock n roll songs.Music that's created by instruments other than guitar / drums / bass / voice / keys / piano -Beatles were first to experiment with various keyboards, sitars and drum loops.The Beatles (and in particular George Martin & Abbey Road engineers) invented production / recording / double tracking techniques that all of those bands use.The notion of an album being a "whole piece" or "concept album" a la Sigur Ros - influenced by Pepper. And medleys a la Abbey Road.The list is endless...............All noted and taken on board, but that only really means that the Beatles opened up those areas, not necessarily meaning that they directly influenced those artists.Incidentaly the first 'recognised' concept album is Little Deuce by the Beach Boys and they were the ones who popularised the use of harmonies too. And Phil Spector is as much a major influence on modern day recording techniques as anything George Martin has done. Though recording techniques are more a production aspect rather than anything majorly to do with the bands themselves.The sitar was introduced into popular music by the Yarbirds in 1965.The list goes on and on with the irregularites and false attributions you've acclaimed to the Beatles there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DustyDeviada Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Incidentaly the first 'recognised' concept album is Little Deuce by the Beach Boys and they were the ones who popularised the use of harmonies too. I must have missed all that doo-wop stuff from the 50s then, and of course barber shop before that.In fact, hasn't just about every form of popular music from the fifth century onwards used harmonies?I think you should apologise immediately for your irregularity and false attribution you've acclaimed to the Beach Boys there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 I must have missed all that doo-wop stuff from the 50s then, and of course barber shop before that.In fact, hasn't just about every form of popular music from the fifth century onwards used harmonies?I think you should apologise immediately for your irregularity and false attribution you've acclaimed to the Beach Boys there. I said popularised, not that they created them. They were one of the first mainstream acts to use them. But i guess that depends on your definition of what 'pop' is Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuartmaxwell Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 songwriting-wise i am influenced by Aereogramme, Jeniferever, Sigur Ros, Mae, Mum (the band, nae my ma), Explosions In The Sky, Grails, Red Sparowes, Isis, Neurosis etc this i HAVE to see/hear Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 this i HAVE to see/hearI didn't say i was as good as them fatty Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 All noted and taken on board, but that only really means that the Beatles opened up those areas, not necessarily meaning that they directly influenced those artists..Not directly, but they were the first so everyone else is a follower! And Phil Spector is as much a major influence on modern day recording techniques as anything George Martin has done. Though recording techniques are more a production aspect rather than anything majorly to do with the bands themselves...Like I said, it was George Martin and the Abbey Road team who redefined recording and production. Look up Wikipedia and you'll spend all day reading about the various gubbins that they invented and pioneered.Was it not the Everly Brothers who popularised harmonies? (in the context you claim the Beach Boys did.) They were as pop as you get at the time. That's it from me on this, like I said, I cannae be arsed arguing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuartmaxwell Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 I didn't say i was as good as them fatty doesnt make it any less funny though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 doesnt make it any less funny thoughCare to elaborate.... or are you just winding folks up again by being silly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Actually' date=' something has just occured to me. I'm going to check it out and will be back shortly with the result! Keep an eye out, Sam the Eagle. Chances are i'm totally off the mark, but I may be able to help you[/quote']I was right - thought there was a totally different version on "Give My Regards To Broad Street" but it's a "coda" of sorts at the end.And it's fucking terrible! Like most of that album!Sorry, mash - up version for you, I think......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 doesnt make it any less funny thoughMwwwhahahahah! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 The sitar was introduced into popular music by the Yarbirds in 1965..Thats bollocks, erm, I mean untrue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Thats bollocks, erm, I mean untrue. Prove me otherwise then fellow Phil. I don't claim to know much about these things you know, i just fucking hate the Beatles Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Anyway, arguing about The Beatles is totally pointless, they influenced and innovated on a scale no other band has ever achieved. 8-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Anyway, arguing about The Beatles is totally pointless, they influenced and innovated on a scale no other band has ever achieved. 8-)I'm not arguing, there's no way anyone's going to change my opinion on them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Prove me otherwise then fellow Phil. I don't claim to know much about these things you know, i just fucking hate the Beatles Back up your claim and I'll easily disprove it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 I'm not arguing, there's no way anyone's going to change my opinion on them.Thats not I mean, I dont mind that you hate The Beatles. Whether you like them or not, they changed the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Back up your claim and I'll easily disprove it.The sitar one?It was the oldest use of a sitar on a mainstream album i could find, i'm not saying it was definately the first just that they used it before the beatles. That was on "Heart Full Of Soul" released on the album "Having A Rave Up" in November 1965 and comprised the main riff of the song. They also used it on "Shapes Of Things" which was recorded around the same time but not released til later.The first recorded/released output of sitar by the Beatles was "Norwegian Wood" which was on "Rubber Soul" which was released in December 1965.Will that do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 The sitar one?It was the oldest use of a sitar on a mainstream album i could find, i'm not saying it was definately the first just that they used it before the beatles. That was on "Heart Full Of Soul" released on the album "Having A Rave Up" in November 1965 and comprised the main riff of the song. They also used it on "Shapes Of Things" which was recorded around the same time but not released til later.The first recorded/released output of sitar by the Beatles was "Norwegian Wood" which was on "Rubber Soul" which was released in December 1965.Will that do?Have you heard the Yardbirds tracks you mention? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Have you heard the Yardbirds tracks you mention?No, why? Although having said that i believe the Beatles may have used sitar on "Another Hard Days Night" which was an instrumental medley on the American release of Help! i don't have an american release date for that yet so i may be prepared to eat humble pie.....i know i'm not going to win against you anyway Edit: *muffled by mouthful of humble pie* August 13th 1965 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 No, why? Although having said that i believe the Beatles may have used sitar on "Another Hard Days Night" which was an instrumental medley on the American release of Help! i don't have an american release date for that yet so i may be prepared to eat humble pie.....i know i'm not going to win against you anyway Norwegian Wood is George's first recorded use with the sitar, but sitar, tablas etc can be seen and heard in the film Help, not played by George though. The Yardbirds recordings you mention feature a young Jeff Beck on guitar playing sitar-esque lines(he uses a MKI Tone Bender fuzz pedal), there is no sitar on any of those recordings. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Norwegian Wood is George's first recorded use with the sitar, but sitar, tablas etc can be seen and heard in the film Help, not played by George though. The Yardbirds recordings you mention feature a young Jeff Beck on guitar playing sitar-esque lines(he uses a MKI Tone Bender fuzz pedal), there is no sitar on any of those recordings.I actually found out that they didn't use the original recordings on the albums. The proper sitar versions were recorded at the same time as the ones that went on the album but weren't released til a later date. They did use a sitar player though for the original recordings so it wasn't an actual mamber of the band that recorded it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 There is a version of "Heart Full of Soul" that has sitar on it. However, I suspect it's a later overdub, as the rest of the track sounds like a rehearsal tape. Sounds like someone in the Yardbirds camp decided to do a little bit of historical revisionism.There's definitely no sitar on either the finished version of "Heart..." or on "Shapes of Things", though.Those are the versions that i'm talking about and although they were released at a later date they were part of the "Having A Rave Up" Sessions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marsh Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 It's fair to say the Beatles popularised or at least brought the instrument to the mainstream at the very least.Argh, i'm getting involved again!Dave, I don't like Dylan, but he certainly was a huge influence on the Beatles (or Lennon, in particular.) I agree he did change the format of songwriting somewhat, but the Beatles were making songs way beyond a simple acoustic guitar and voice or any of the stuff he did with the Band. I'm really thinking of Rubber Soul and Revolver as the benchmarks of songs that weren't just intro / verse / chorus / verse / chorus / outro. The Beatles changed music forever more. Tomorrow Never Knows? Nothing like it before and the Chemical Brothers have tried for over decade to better it . And failed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MKII Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 There is a version of "Heart Full of Soul" that has sitar on it. However, I suspect it's a later overdub, as the rest of the track sounds like a rehearsal tape. Sounds like someone in the Yardbirds camp decided to do a little bit of historical revisionism.Yes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted October 26, 2006 Report Share Posted October 26, 2006 Dylan was John The Baptist (after torturing a thief...) to the Beatles' Jesus, if you like.That is terrible :/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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