Hog Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 Let's see... thousands potentially dead and massive security risk against the nation vs. confusing about 20 kids by saying "excuse me one moment' date=' I need to answer a call"..[/quote']Very well said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alvin Starclusk Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 I've never been able to take anything Moore's said seriously after reading his hilariously ill-informed take on the Northern Ireland situation. If he can get that so wrong, he can get just about anything wrong. His scatter-shot approach to documentary making does him no favours either. If he just concentrated on the main issue instead of going off on wild, often completely irrelevant tangents, he'd present his viewpoint a hell of a lot better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 I've never been able to take anything Moore's said seriously after reading his hilariously ill-informed take on the Northern Ireland situation. If he can get that so wrong' date=' he can get just about anything wrong. [/quote']What did he say, out of interest? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alvin Starclusk Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 What did he say' date=' out of interest?[/quote']Can't remember the exact words, don;t have the book to hand, but it was along the lines of converting Northern Ireland's Protestants to the Catholicism. It's a solution alright... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Posted June 3, 2006 Report Share Posted June 3, 2006 Can't remember the exact words' date=' don;t have the book to hand, but it was along the lines of converting Northern Ireland's Protestants to the Catholicism. It's a solution alright...[/quote']o_OAnd I thought the man was an idiot before....I wonder if he's even aware that the Protestants just happen to be in the majority there... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
framheim Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 This is a very useful resource for non-Moore-ists; http://www.discoverthenetwork.org/individualProfile.asp?indid=899Obviously it's written from a right-wing perspective' date=' and I'm not in favour of the agenda they are pushing either, but it does provide many useful links to works by serious writers who have exposed the fallacies behind Moore's version of events.I particularly like the bit right at the end of the article. The man's a self-aggrandaising hypocrite with feet of clay.[/quote']that articles no better than any of moore's work.it's just the same schtick but from the opposite point of view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doom donkey Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 Can't remember the exact words' date=' don;t have the book to hand, but it was along the lines of converting Northern Ireland's Protestants to the Catholicism. It's a solution alright...[/quote']If you were shocked by that I'd advise you not to read "A Modest Proposal" by Swift he suggests eating babies to solve poverty... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alvin Starclusk Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 If you were shocked by that I'd advise you not to read "A Modest Proposal" by Swift he suggests eating babies to solve poverty...To be perfectly honest, I'm sure that quote was fairly tongue in cheek, but there was a whole chapter spouting the ill-informed American view of the troubles that kept the IRA nicely supplied with funding for weapons for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EchelonDivision Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 Bet you the fat sack of shite has set the whole thing up so that he can do one of his one-sided expose' jobs on the American legal system.The guy's a self-serving tosspot.Farenheit 911 was a dreadful movie - on many levels.I hated that scene where Bush was at a kid's school and alledgedly got the announcement about Twin Towers.Moore takes the complete piss out of Bush's reaction to the news - what exactly was the man expected to do? Just get up and leave a bunch of confused children? Tell the kids "Hey kids ' date='Twin Towers has just been fucked, lots of people are dead, some may be your relatives"?I have no time for old G-Dubya, but you could see the life draining out of him before your very eyes - yet Moore used it as an opportunity to take an uncalled for, undignified cheap shot.For shame.DZLPs - he's a Fat Cunt.[/quote']The fact that George Bush didn't react is incredibley suspicious. He's the commander in chief and he never even gave a response when he knew America was under attack. His appearence at the Elementary School was also public knowledge, surely he should have been rushed to safety as he would have been a potential target. Unless of course he knew exactly what was happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scootray Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 The fact that George Bush didn't react is incredibley suspicious. He's the commander in chief and he never even gave a response when he knew America was under attack. His appearence at the Elementary School was also public knowledge' date=' surely he should have been rushed to safety as he would have been a potential target. Unless of course he knew exactly what was happening.[/quote']Wow, you don't know much about public relations. If he was rushed away there would be mass panic, etc.Also, to give an immediate response after being told America was under attack would be pointless. For a start, he would need to be briefed on the situation in order to make a statement.All this conspiracy shite about him organising an attack is the most luaghable thing I've heard in years. Get a grip. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EchelonDivision Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 Wow' date=' you don't know much about public relations. If he was rushed away there would be mass panic, etc.Also, to give an immediate response after being told America was under attack would be pointless. For a start, he would need to be briefed on the situation in order to make a statement.All this conspiracy shite about him organising an attack is the most luaghable thing I've heard in years. Get a grip.[/quote']Erm, mass panic.. The Pentagon is hit by a plane, both the Twin Towers are hit, the Whitehouse is evacuated. I reckon most people were kinda panicing anyway. Why we he need to be breifed exactly? Two planes have hit the WTC just as intelligence reports said they would. The conspiracy is the official account (which is laughable).You really don't know much about US foreign policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diesel Posted June 4, 2006 Report Share Posted June 4, 2006 Let's see... thousands potentially dead and massive security risk against the nation vs. confusing about 20 kids by saying "excuse me one moment' date=' I need to answer a call".In regards to my thoughts on the film... I enjoyed it as entertainment, perhaps because I'd consider myself intelligent enough to realise how one sided it is. Saying that, I appreciate that Moore exists... the film itself, although is propaganda is very clever is with it's selective cuts of information. Ehat I do like is that everything is true, even if tailored to point in a specific direction.I'm not 100% anti-Iraq as I know people out there and when you hear the side that doesn't hit the media you change you're opinion pretty fast. I'm now very glad that there are people out there.[/quote']Spot on Lester, the very quote you made..."I enjoyed it as entertainment"...just underlines the point that I'm trying to make. Moore took a situation and attempted to make a comedy sketch out of it..."thousands potentially dead and massive security risk against the nation"...highly entertaining indeed.I still don't know what Bush was expected to do, thing thing had already gone off big time, Bush isn't a fire-fighter or a paramedic and was nowhere near the place, so continuing with his committment was as reasonable a choice as any.Like I said, I'm no fan of Dubya, but I can't believe he'd sanction something as financially crippling and demoralising as 911 as an excuse to start a war. No, sad (and worrying) to say, it was a piece of tactical genius by some very resourceful terrorists.DZL Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monk Rocker Posted June 5, 2006 Report Share Posted June 5, 2006 that's a ridiculous argument. moore's style is tailored to be easily understood by all' date=' he's the everyman of documentary filmmaking. to say people of a low iq can't understand the message and so will blindly follow the government is silly. moore's films and books are almost low brow in their approach to journalism and use direct, confrontational techniques to showcase his arguments rather than laying them out through complex monologues like other documentarians. moore makes films specifically aimed at low attention spans, low iq americans yet is made out to be this bastion of middle class dissent by those he opposes. and either way, it's not moore's fault people are stupid. that's a goverments responsibility.[/quote']It's not a ridiculous arguement at all. A didactic monologue by a speaker with high authority is more effective than reasoned debate from someone of similar social standing for an audience of lower intelligence. The opposite is true for an audience that's more intelligent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
framheim Posted June 5, 2006 Report Share Posted June 5, 2006 It's not a ridiculous arguement at all. A didactic monologue by a speaker with high authority is more effective than reasoned debate from someone of similar social standing for an audience of lower intelligence. The opposite is true for an audience that's more intelligent.okay i see what you're saying there, though i still think moore's approach makes it easier to grasp his arguments. also it's a fairly large generalisation. low iq isn't the same as being cynical or having common sense. you don't have to be a member of mensa to suspect the government of lying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EchelonDivision Posted June 5, 2006 Report Share Posted June 5, 2006 Like I said' date=' I'm no fan of Dubya, but I can't believe he'd sanction something as financially crippling and demoralising as 911 as an excuse to start a war. No, sad (and worrying) to say, it was a piece of tactical genius by some very resourceful terrorists.[/quote']Not just to start a war, but to start several simultaeneous theatre wars anywhere in the world, in the name of 'terror', without the other country having attacked the US or her allies. There may soon be another major terrorist incident which will be blamed on Iran/Hezbollah and pave the way for the tactical nuclear strikes against Iranian Nuclear sites.Whenever there is a crime, the perpetrators are always the people who have most to gain from such an incident. The US have gained more from 9/11 than any other country on the planet. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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