Guest Philip Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by soundian:The dictionary defintion is definitive for this time and this culture. ... which many people disagree with and choose to ignore because it isn't definitive to them! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 The dictionary definition:Music. 1. An art or art form consisting of organised tones that produce a coherent sequence of sounds intended to elicit a pleasurable response in a listener. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by Philip:... which many people disagree with and choose to ignore because it isn't definitive to them! Let's all just ignore the definitions of words, that'll make life easier. If I call something a fishcake and you call it a tangerine, who's right? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by soundian:Let's all just ignore the definitions of words, that'll make life easier. If I call something a fishcake and you call it a tangerine, who's right? Erm, dont be silly... look at the dictionary definition, would you say it covers all aspects of what you believe music to be?I dont, this is why I started this thread to try and find a better or at least broader one with the input from others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by Philip:Erm, dont be silly... look at the dictionary definition, would you say it covers all aspects of what you believe music to be?I dont, this is why I started the thread to try and find a better or at least broader one with the input from others. My point was, if we all go around calling things by our own personal definitions we wouldn't get very far. Music is defined, you're trying to find a word which encompasses music and other sounds which sound like music to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by soundian:My point was, if we all go around calling things by our own personal definitions we wouldn't get very far. Music is defined, you're trying to find a word which encompasses music and other sounds which sound like music to you. That definition implies that music has to be organised(what about spontaneous free improvisation?) and pleasurable to listen to(what about music that evokes hate, violence etc?)It is clearly a failed definition, yes/no?I am not trying to make it fit into what I consider music to be, it should be universal! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by Philip:That definition implies that music has to be organised(what about spontaneous free improvisation?) and pleasurable to listen to(what about music that evokes hate, violence etc?)It is clearly a failed definition, yes/no?I am not trying to make it fit into what I consider music to be, it should be universal! I would argue with that definition as well, but I bet your dictionary points out that it's art, created by humans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 Originally posted by soundian:I would argue with that definition as well, but I bet your dictionary points out that it's art, created by humans. Yes it does, but some of Rob's questions have raised some interesting points about intent and perception... If I was presented with a recording, but had no knowledge about how the sounds came to be recorded, ie: was it organised/manipulated, or was it a straight recording of natural sound, the intent or unintent behind the recording would make no diffrence to how I listened to it!I may or may not hear the recording as music.Which is why I now think that music is a perception of sound and silence.A perception that is influenced by time, place and circumstance etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RF Scott Posted March 6, 2004 Report Share Posted March 6, 2004 does it really matter what the dictionary says?in my eyes, philip is right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 On reflection, my above and previous definitions have been to broad or extreme, where as the dictionary one isn't broad or extreme enough.What's needed is something in between, anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 Originally posted by Philip:Yes it does, but some of Rob's questions have raised some interesting points about intent and perception... If I was presented with a recording, but had no knowledge about how the sounds came to be recorded, ie: was it organised/manipulated, or was it a straight recording of natural sound, the intent or unintent behind the recording would make no diffrence to how I listened to it!I may or may not hear the recording as music.Which is why I now think that music is a perception of sound and silence.A perception that is influenced by time, place and circumstance etc. How you perceive it will not change what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 7, 2004 Report Share Posted March 7, 2004 Originally posted by soundian:How you perceive it will not change what it is. Yes, I agree!It's quite amusing that I've/we have managed to post so many what if's and questions etc, but still not got any closer to finding a better definition than the current dictionary one!I'm giving up on this, thank's for all the interesting questions and points of view. Wow, a thread which has managed to stay clear of any nasty comments etc, beautiful. Think I'll go and listen to some MUSIC now, King Crimson anyone? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ibid Posted March 8, 2004 Report Share Posted March 8, 2004 This is almost as bad as "define God"!!!!Music as a human generated art form is and always will be, a series of tones based on a predictable mathematical series and obeying the rules of harmony. In other words, the laws of the material universe define exactly what what music can and will be. That these rules are interpreted and applied by human beings is what gives music its diversity and allows individuals to determine for themselves just what, to them, is music.But, from an entirely reductionist point of view (and I must admit a souless and clinical one which I don't share) it's a series of rigidly applied mathematical rules. Hence Peter Andre being at number one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest WalkingOnGlass Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 Music is My Minds Weapon... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest highroller Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 cue the onslaught.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by jamesy weapon:Music is My Minds Weapon... The ego has landed. I'm only posting this because Ben insisted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest highroller Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 read it again and see what he meant....think about it peeps...! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest RomanChoke Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 What a totally crap thread! I can't believe you wasted your time posting that. Everybody Knows what music is, no offence at all Philip, but your definition is just a variation of mine and probably exactly identical to several others yet, in a minor way, slightly different to a billion others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by Ben Quik:read it again and see what he meant....think about it peeps...! Where's the need for the onslaught if you read it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsinatra Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 I think people need to understand that music is whatever you want it to be, i f u like the sound of a car horn then that could be music to you, don't try to define music lets just all enjoy it, please.and anyway who reads dictionaries, there for old men with skunks for shoes, plus the dictionary that your reading no doubt was published in the 80's.......nuf said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Philip Posted March 15, 2004 Report Share Posted March 15, 2004 Originally posted by RomanChoke:What a totally crap thread! I can't believe you wasted your time posting that. Everybody Knows what music is, no offence at all Philip, but your definition is just a variation of mine and probably exactly identical to several others yet, in a minor way, slightly different to a billion others. And there was I, on a music site, wishing to know other peoples opinions and definitions on what music is to them etc. How wrong of me do such a thing!!Goodbye aberdeen-music.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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