Guest Page 99 Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 That is a totally bizarre notion' date=' as any real artist in any medium will tell you.[/quote']Just a question... how many of these people do you actualy think consider themselves as 'artists'? I bet it's actualy very few. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen B Posted June 23, 2005 Report Share Posted June 23, 2005 i also agree with thatprobably hypocracy but fuck it' date=' check the fucking weather, IM OFF TO THE PUB!I think the point is that all the retro re-spewing of 80S music is ok but its not actually worth getting too exited about....diluted real stuff, so diluted its completely harmless*heads for beer garden*[/quote']How does something being re-spewed make it diluted? If it's so harmless quite fucking whinging about it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betamax Posted June 24, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 24, 2005 How does something being re-spewed make it diluted?usually with lumps of carrot, scrambled egg and watery bits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsinatra Posted June 24, 2005 Report Share Posted June 24, 2005 I personnaly think it is highly important that people sing in a way which best pleases them, if my " natural" voice was not suiting the music i was playing, of course i would probably try and make minor adjustments. Take sigur ros into account, they have there very own made up language which jonsi sings called "hopelandish", it is mainly made up of very icelandic sounding words with long spiraling vowels, but it is beautiful. I know it dosn't really address the whole 80's singing thing you guys were talking about, but i think it shows that you can choose to sing as you wish, its your voice after all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Tam o' Shantie Posted June 24, 2005 Report Share Posted June 24, 2005 I personnaly think it is highly important that people sing in a way which best pleases them' date=' if my " natural" voice was not suiting the music i was playing, of course i would probably try and make minor adjustments. [b']Take sigur ros into account, they have there very own made up language which jonsi sings called "hopelandish", it is mainly made up of very icelandic sounding words with long spiraling vowels, but it is beautiful. I know it dosn't really address the whole 80's singing thing you guys were talking about, but i think it shows that you can choose to sing as you wish, its your voice after all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flyingsinatra Posted June 24, 2005 Report Share Posted June 24, 2005 fair enough Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 28, 2005 Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 As I say' date=' it's a compromise between your expression and keeping an eye on your audience. Otherwise play in your bedroom then.[/quote']Why?What's the point in writing music to please an audience? If thats the case... just save yourself the work and join a covers band.Rather' date=' I consider making music purely for your enjoyment and not to spread your ideas to others far more egotistic. .[/quote']The point Betamax is trying to make is that.... yeah... people make music for enjoyment but the bands he is talking about should surely feel either guilt or shame.... their name is on the cover... they've made it... but wait... they've made it with stolen riffs and used ideas. How can you feel proud of something you haven't really made yourself? They are false and the fact that bands like that can make it makes me feel sick. It's like putting ona fashion show of your designs and then going into topshop and just using the clothes straight out the shop but adding on a belt or taking away a ribbon - or some other minor detail -... then saying "Hey, look at my amazing original design!!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen B Posted June 28, 2005 Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 As I say' date=' it's a compromise between your expression and keeping an eye on your audience. Otherwise play in your bedroom then.[/quote']Why?What's the point in writing music to please an audience? If thats the case... just save yourself the work and join a covers band.Rather' date=' I consider making music purely for your enjoyment and not to spread your ideas to others far more egotistic. .[/quote']The point Betamax is trying to make is that.... yeah... people make music for enjoyment but the bands he is talking about should surely feel either guilt or shame.... their name is on the cover... they've made it... but wait... they've made it with stolen riffs and used ideas. How can you feel proud of something you haven't really made yourself? They are false and the fact that bands like that can make it makes me feel sick. It's like putting ona fashion show of your designs and then going into topshop and just using the clothes straight out the shop but adding on a belt or taking away a ribbon - or some other minor detail -... then saying "Hey, look at my amazing original design!!"These bands share a sound maybe but there are very few example of riff stealing. And these bands don't claim to be amzing themselves. NME does and they end up being scorned by folks like you much more than they deserve as a result. There are millions of bands out there who aren't necessarily fashionable but "steal" ideas from older bands, but the fact that they are not fashionable means they are of no concern to you. Your dislike of bands because they are fashionable is even worse than the idiots who like them purely because they are the "in thing". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NARC Posted June 28, 2005 Report Share Posted June 28, 2005 Lester Burnham you are being completely daft. This is basically what you are saying: Alex Kapranos walks into his local record shop and picks up some Gang of Four, Mission of Burma and Joy Division albums. Extremely impressed by his those particular bands' image and music, he buys all the requisite clothes, a telecaster (because Andy Gill played one, don't forget) and forms a band intent in recreating the same riffs and structure of the songs he has heard from the period 1978-82. He immediately understands that they are going to be commercial successes because they are playing a type of music that smashed chart record history in the past (NOT). They take all the critical acclaim and other bands immediately spring up and become popular because Franz are, and angular guitar rock is in.Now I don't even particularly like Franz Ferdinand to begin with. Yes they share a sound, but would you accuse them of riff stealing? Would you accuse the Futureheads of riff stealing? I would like to see you have a go and become bankrupt in the inevitably failed court case.Have a look a the "old guard's" clothing style as well, since you brought it up. In general, I don't think you will find considerably matching styles too often between any of the "new wave" and initial post-punk bands.Finally, you and others seem rather too obsessed with originality. Modern rock or whatever cannot ever be truly modern. The band format and conventional instrument method cannnot be utilised in a truly original manner any more. Anything you hear nowadays will be a modern derivative of certain genres and styles already pioneered by somebody else. It's simple mathematics. Years x number of artists in universe, ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soundian Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Franz Ferdinand, the best thing since slice cheeeeeeeese!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Funnily enough I quite like Franz Ferdinand...I realise I worded my responce particularly badly... Franz aren't that guilty of it... they were more or less at the start of this new wave of cool. It's more the bands that you'll find on the cover of NME more recently that piss me off... right so the riffs aren't directly copied... but the styles are so close to even the bands that are still considered "fresh" now... the bands I'd personally use as reference to this are more or less Razorlight's first NME cover and onwards. Just seems that right now that the bands "making it" seem for too similar to the bands breaking out even a year ago. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NARC Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 I was just using Franz as an example. I don't particularly like them. Razorlight are fucking awful. But this year, breakthrough artists like The Departure, Bloc Party and Editors etc. are comfortably individual... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 I was just using Franz as an example. I don't particularly like them. Razorlight are fucking awful. But this year' date=' breakthrough artists like The Departure, Bloc Party and Editors etc. are comfortably individual...[/quote']Again... The Departure and Bloc Party... I quite like. Don't know enough about the editors to pass comment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NARC Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Well the Interpol comparisons are inevitable, but they are really good. Great gig at Kef in June... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larsen B Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Funnily enough I quite like Franz Ferdinand...I realise I worded my responce particularly badly... Franz aren't that guilty of it... they were more or less at the start of this new wave of cool. It's more the bands that you'll find on the cover of NME more recently that piss me off... right so the riffs aren't directly copied... but the styles are so close to even the bands that are still considered "fresh" now... the bands I'd personally use as reference to this are more or less Razorlight's first NME cover and onwards. Just seems that right now that the bands "making it" seem for too similar to the bands breaking out even a year ago.I thought your problem was with them ripping off older band like Gang of Four etc. In which case Franz would be guilty as all the others. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betamax Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 Lester Burnham you are being completely daft. This is basically what you are saying: Alex Kapranos walks into his local record shop and picks up some Gang of Four' date=' Mission of Burma and Joy Division albums. Extremely impressed by his those particular bands' image and music, he buys all the requisite clothes, a telecaster (because Andy Gill played one, don't forget) and forms a band intent in recreating the same riffs and structure of the songs he has heard from the period 1978-82. Have a look a the "old guard's" clothing style as well, since you brought it up. In general, I don't think you will find considerably matching styles too often between any of the "new wave" and initial post-punk bands.I know someone who knew Alex quite well around the time his first band flopped and he was busy designing his new band FF.....your theorey is actually spot on to what i heard from said person , but hey yeh, at least they got there ahead of the pack.....its the follow through copy bands, who are actually guilty of copying a copy band that are the ones I try to avoidInterpol are fucking shite btw (apart from comedy value)....like a butlins band doing joy division covers....oh fuck!....talk about cashing in on someone elses ideas! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HummerOfIntenseEvil Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 I was just using Franz as an example. I don't particularly like them. Razorlight are fucking awful. But this year' date=' breakthrough artists like The Departure, Bloc Party and Editors etc. are comfortably individual...[/quote']Hmm.... I saw The Departure support the Manics in January, and while they were reasonably enjoyable, the whole way through I was thinking "gosh, where have I heard this style of music before? Oh yes, every other band going about just now." The only difference between The Departure and every other we-have-no-bass-control-on-our-amps band at the moment is that The Departure seem to do it rather well. And with a singer who sounds a bit like a young Brett Anderson.Heard an Editors song on the radio a couple of days ago, and if they hadn't said "this is the Editors" beforehand, I'd have went away thinking it was Interpol. Even the vocal style was copied.All three bands seem decent enough, but it doesn't change the fact that they bare an uncomfortably close similarity to other "angular" sounding bands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 I thought your problem was with them ripping off older band like Gang of Four etc. In which case Franz would be guilty as all the others.True.... I do have a problem with it... and Franz are guilty.My main problem is bands ripping off other modern bands.I realise I'm not making much sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimr Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 back to the nazi concentration camp with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 If only positive scene points still existed.That made my lunch break Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimr Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 lunch? oh dear. Someone has sabotaged my laptop into thinking its 8.23. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HummerOfIntenseEvil Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 True.... I do have a problem with it... and Franz are guilty.My main problem is bands ripping off other modern bands.I realise I'm not making much sense.Makes sense to me. There's nothing wrong with a band looking to past music and trying to reinterpret a style in their own way, but bands who just ape the current zeitgiest in order to get some quick exposure are just lazy, and usually get found out unless the songs they produce are so good that it seems they started the style themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NARC Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 back to the nazi concentration camp with you.What? You mean the one you are already in?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jimr Posted June 29, 2005 Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 my ma called me a jew the other day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
betamax Posted June 29, 2005 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2005 ........bands who just ape the current zeitgiest in order to get some quick exposure are just lazy' date=' and usually get found out unless the songs they produce are so good that it seems they started the style themselves.[/quote']exacto>mundo>example of band with songs so good* it seems they started the style themselves THE KILLERS, FRANZ FERDINAND, FISCHERSPOONERexample of bands lazily apeing current zeitgiest in order to get some quick exposure THE BRAVERY, BLOC PARTY, INTERPOL, THE DEPARTURE, FUTUREHEADS, KAISER CHEIFSsee what i did, copied someone elses words and re-packed them as my own!....dead clever eh? i also blame the NME but mostly its sponge headed readersdunno if Razorlight fit into the debate though......they are just too shit to even discuss*i still dont like FF much but can acknowledge they can write tres decent songs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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