Moshulu Rob

I didn't think it was too bad when he was just putting up one thread a week with what he played the saturday before so people could have a look if they went along. But I agree 8 weeks worth was probably excessive.

R

It is still confimed for Moshulu currently, although we may possibly change the venue.

Now that the touring support is confirmed as ThisGirl and Oceansize, both of whom have their own Big backlines and Drum kits we have to be 100% confident we can accomodate this so early into our career as a live venue. There is always a danger of trying to run before you can walk and none of us are arrogant enough to believe we know all there is to know so soon. The decision is scheduled to be made over the next couple of days between ourselves as the venue and the promoters and sound engineers.

Whatever happens you will all be kept informed.

Rob

Originally posted by Rob Karloff

I wasn't arguing. I was trying to make a point, and that point being that "tarring with the same brush" is a very blinkered way to do things. I look at people based on their attitude and actions, not on what their perceived social group generally does. Ergo, if someone in Burberry is civil and good-natured to me, then I'll quite happily engage them. Conversely, if someone attempts to fuck me around, burberry *or* flamed cap, they'll receive a sharpened response. At the end of the day it's your deal, and if you want a dress-code and only a certain clientele, you'll have it.

Also, I never stated you were a racist, nor did I imply it. I made the assertion that racism was discrimination based on a kind of appearence, and suggested that the basic premise of discrimination should be un-justifiable. A world where you are taken on your individual character, actions and abilities, rather than outward appearence, would be much better place to travel life in....

Rob I completely agree about judging people on appearance from a personal point of view, although I hope you would agree that with up to 800 people through the door on a Friday, you sometimes have to make quick decisions, for what you hope is the general good of the club and it's guests. Yes that may mean you occasionally make the wrong call, but it's only a night club, I'm not deciding on whether someone gets a liver transplant. I think that if on balance you generally get it right (and I believe we do) then that's all you can do.

I appreciate you weren't calling me a racist or even implying it, I jumped the gun a little because It's one of my personal hatreds. I apologise.

Rob

Unless you look exactly like this

You'll be fine.

And we never even suggested anything as ridiculous as Black clothing and no sportswear.

Guy's, nothings changed.

It's a debate which we can't win.

Flik and I are are talking about a tiny minority of people, who have never been let in here and never will be. Not only that, they would not be let into any club/bar in Aberdeen run by half sane managers or Doorstaff. However, as I said before, It's good fun to argue and if that means assuming people mean something completely different then so be it. I understood at first when perhaps Flik didn't make it abundantly clear what he meant, but I think I have made the point as clearly as I could.

Tell you what Johnny, come work a shift with me one night, you can be the aberdeen-music representative and post your views on how the club is run.

Rob.

the difference really is quite something, tight clean mids/high end with a big fat sub covering the low end.

I'm sure you'll both be keen to try out our new 7.5k Bose sound system in the back room on saturday

8)

Exactly Ian,

I wouldn't suggest it is even a big problem at the moment, what we have had is:

A guy spitting a big greenie on the bartop next to me - Out

A guy trying to buy Coke off Flik - Out

A guy writing Graffiti upstairs - Out

Twice obvious pill heads gurning - Out

And that's about it, compare that record over 3 months with Liquid, Jumpin Jacks, Ministry, Priory, Bex, etc etc and I think it holds up well. All we were ever talking about was classic hardcore pissed up Neds anyway, and I wish Flik had never posted it at all now.

Still, live and learn

The sign at the door is an idea, but I feel it would probably provoke people further, a simple - 'it's not your thing tonight mate' usually suffices.

I think the problem with these message boards is that it is too easy to have argument's because you like having an argument and therefore try and convert someone else's perfectly reasonable point of view into one with which you can have a nice old argument.

For Example, in this thread I was arguing for turning away the classic hardcore ned, pissed up and out of his mind on drugs, which I don't think anyone would argue with. And you and Rob were arguing thinking we were going to start banning shoes and having elitist door pickers, which again is perfectly rational for you to argue against.

So, lets pick differing, irrational points of view to all take and have a nice fun argument.

Rob

Originally posted by Rob Karloff

I defy anyone to stand and tell me that the clothes you wear or your general chosen appearence defines your likely behaviour.

..........

Taking judgements based on appearence is exactly what racists do. Now tell me how you justify doing this in ANY shape or form?

OK, racism is based upon a persons skin colour or ethnicity, over which they have no choice, is no reflection on their personality, and is therefore completely irrational and without justification.

The clothes someone wears are a reflection of their personality, after all they have made the concious decision to choose and wear them.

Some items of clothing become linked Inextricably over time with loose sociological groups, the most obvious in this case being soccer casuals, the social uniform for which is Burberry, Stone Island, Prada etc etc. As the group becomes identifiable people can choose to 'buy into' that group by purchasing and wearing items of this 'social uniform'. By buying into this group you are agreeing with the morals and beliefs of the other members of that group to some extent. Now, of course some people may purchase a burberry cap because they like it, but that is not a 'social uniform' only when paired with other items does the effect take hold, which removes a large factor of chance from the occasion.

Your example of not being allowed into Yates Rob, is correct in some sense because they have succesfully identified the type of music you like due to your social uniform, where it falls down is in their stereotyping of that social group. What they don't realise, is that on average there is far less trouble from people in your 'social uniform' than from people in the uniform of the soccer casual.

So to sum up, yes you can make descions about which social group a person feels they belong to, based upon their dress, and there is a raft of work by sociologists about this. What you have to be careful about is how you personally stereotype the social group that someone has chosen to buy into.

In our case we take decisions for the greater good of the guests in the club, so If the worlds biggest rock fan, and nicest guy in the world turns up in white trainers, tracksuit bottoms tucked into white socks, blue and white hooped Henry Lloyd Jumper and Burberry cap, and further more doesn't sufficiently articulate their love of the music and general good nature then I'm afraid that they aren't getting in that evening.

If someone wants to call me racist for that, they can blow me.

Originally posted by Moshulu Rob

I think that Flik was making the comedy point that if you turn up in Tracksuit bottoms tucked into your socks and white trainers, with a Burberry shirt, Jacket and cap on you are unlikely to get in.

As always it gets a little mis represented on a message board,

at no point was he suggesting you can't wear a shirt, or trousers, or shoes or anything like that.

Don't get your knickers in a twist ladies.

Originally posted by stuartmaxwell

the bouncers banned amir and have been total cox to him since

fair dos he is a nippy wee shite when hes had a few but

GET AMIR BACK IN MOSHULU

No, I banned him, I tolerate alot, but being called a fucking racist, to my face, when I was trying to give him an opportunity to come back to the club is an insult too far I'm afraid

Originally posted by DaveAUBL

I'm gonna buy me some burberry boxers, whatcha gonna do?

As long as you don't wear them on your head.................................on second thoughts, turn up with them on your head and get in Free and Drink for free whilst wearing them.

Rob

OK,

Back Room :

DJ Booth moved and painted

walls painted

pillars painted

hatch added in Bar

new pictures put up

lighting moved around and gelled

Front Room:

Walls Painted

Designs added

Pillars Painted

White Strips added to stairs

Large Logo Painted on the wall

Lighting Gelled

Upstairs:

Bench Seating Added

Walls Painted

Curtain behind Cash Desk

Today/Tomorrow:

Stage Created

DJ Booth Mooved

Drum Riser Sorted

Thats all for now

I think that Flik was making the comedy point that if you turn up in Tracksuit bottoms tucked into your socks and white trainers, with a Burberry shirt, Jacket and cap on you are unlikely to get in.

As always it gets a little mis represented on a message board,

at no point was he suggesting you can't wear a shirt, or trousers, or shoes or anything like that.

Johnny, when was the last time you saw a bouncer asleep in the corner? Most of our Doormen are here because they have had enough of working doors where there is loads of trouble and come here because they like the crowd and the lack of trouble, yes I agree they can sometimes get a little complacent about that, but I would rather have a bunch of guys used to rough places that can handle it if it ever does really go off, than a bunch of keen and eager youngsters who wouldn't have a clue. My favourite story is Dyzer, who was working the door at Drum and refused entry to a couple of casuals. They Returned with a Scafolding Pole and smacked him round the head with it, he got up, took it off them, and chased them down the road

Don't forget that Caged was the first Rock night in Moshulu, and that's our own night. Bond*age came a few weeks later (thank the Lord), and we didn't clone the Idea of Bond*age from the Palace, the same DJ's (Ross and Co) and Alan, the Old Manager of the Palace approached us about bringing the night here, so in essence it is the same night with a different venue.

Originally posted by stuartmaxwell

was fucking dire, nobody there either

looks like a club struggling for ideas on a saturday, but putting a nite on cos they reckon that people will flock due to the success of other nites

nobody wants to go to moshulu every nite of the week

it needs a new idea for a saturday, something totally different

OK, you complain that the music was Dire, are obviously a regular and so enjoy the music on other nights, and then accuse us of trying to cash in by doing another night the same as all the rest?

Surely if it was the same as the other nights then you would have enjoyed the music.

I am not interested in promoting any Dance/Cheese nights here anymore because:

a) I hate the music

b) I get nothing but trouble from 80% of the Guests

c) Our regular crowd, who we do care about, should be able to turn up anynight of the week and enjoy themselves without feeling completely out of place.

d) A very distant fourth, it is hard to promote anything else when we are percieved, rightly or wrongly, as a rock club, or as I have heard it described 'a fuckin Goth club min'

When we were coming up with an Idea for Saturday we had to look at the market in Aberdeen, we figured that there was a load of people out there who were into the scene 10 years ago and now have nowhere in Aberdeen playing that Music, and didn't go on a Friday because

a) they no longer followed the latest music as avidly as they did

b) they probably felt a little out of place on friday's which seem to primarily attract 18-24's

Also, we felt that there was a smaller demand for things like extreme metal and Underground industrial, so we run these nights monthly in the back room.

So, we ran a tester night and attracted 200+ on a Bank Holiday Sunday, launched it on the saturday and grew the crowds from 150 to 350, then had a quiet week (175) on Saturday, so we are not panicking just yet thanks. We are in the middle of the Summer when most of our target audience for the Saturday is either on Holdiay, Skint because they are just back from Holiday or Saving to go on holiday. Remember that out target group likely has kids and a mortgage now so this is an affecting factor far more than for Students. Lately we see approximately 50% of Friday's numbers on a Saturday and if you compare a club night that has been open for 13 weeks against one that has been open for 5 years I think we are doing OK.

So, maybe I shouldn't feel the need to justify what we do on a message board, but as a team we do spend alot of time trying to give the nights an individual identity and appeal to different segments of a large and loosely defined marketplace, but it is a little aggrieving to be accused of struggling for Ideas and cashing in on other nights.

Besides If we didn't do it, someone else would.

Re: sux

Originally posted by mr de-lux

MOSHULU SUX BIG TIME THAT PLACE SUX 24/7 YOU WILL NEVER SEE ME THERE!

IF I WANTED TO HANG OUT WITH KIDS I WOULD STAND OUTSIDE "ELEMENTZ" or what ever its called

Ah Ha, another well thought out and carefully considered reply, obviously based on personal experience and with the benefit of Age.

These are the sort of helpful comments we can use to improve the nights at Moshulu.

Tell me, have you considered a career in the hospitality business?

Thanks for the input

Rob

PS. If you could just not shout so much next time, and maybe speak in english I would appreciate it.

Oh, and I've never seen anyone over 18 talk in 'text speak' or whatever it is called.

Just a reminder,

Every Thursday, the boys and girls from one up Dj'ing the finest records from the last four decades. Old Fovourites and new songs you won't be able to live without.

8-12 in HJB

Rob