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ban on smoking in england too :)

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Smoking ban proposed for England

A smoking ban was put forward by the Scottish Executive last week

Smoking could be banned in every cafe, restaurant and most pubs in England within a few years under plans being unveiled by the government on Tuesday.

The White Paper on Public Health will plan to make most enclosed public areas, including offices and factories, smoke-free.

Only private clubs, where members voted to allow smoking, and pubs which do not serve prepared food would be exempt.

The plans mean that up to 90% of bars could be smoke-free within a few years.

The proposals go further than had been expected.

But some opponents of smoking are disappointed that they stop short of an outright ban, while pro-smokers have attacked "an attempt to demonise smokers".

The Scottish Executive put forward a blanket ban on smoking in enclosed public places last week, but Health Secretary John Reid will not go that far in the proposals for England.

Smoking will still be allowed in pubs which limit their food sales to snacks such as crisps, rather than prepared meals.

However, BBC Home Editor Mark Easton said the plans went much further than predicted as ministers had been thinking about voluntary bans.

He said it could be two or three years before a ban came into effect, although government buildings such as hospitals and schools might bring one in sooner.

There would also have to be wide consultation, including with the catering and pro-smoking lobby, he said.

The White Paper will also cover obesity, drinking and sexual and mental health.

In the foreword, the government will say it wants to create an environment in which people are encouraged to adopt healthy lifestyles.

But the white paper will say it is not the role of government to force people to become healthy.

A Department of Health spokesman said: "The principle of the white paper is to inform choice.

"People want to be able to make their own decisions but they want credible information."

The paper was drawn up after one of the largest public consultations, involving 150,000 people, over the summer.

The Department of Health received more than 1,000 submissions from individuals alone - unheard of for a white paper.

Among other plans are a ban on junk food advertising before 9pm on TV to protect children and a "traffic light" system showing shoppers how healthy the food they are buying is.

High fat foods would be labelled red, while healthy foods would get a green sticker.

But it would be up to supermarkets to decide whether to introduce the system. Some are already drawing up their own codes.

Ed Gershon, of the pub chain JD Wetherspoon, said the smoking ban would be good for business.

"The majority of people don't like to be around smoky areas. We think it will bring a lot more people back into pubs long-term."

But the reforms do not impress some campaigners, who had called for more radical measures.

The British Medical Association (BMA), which wants a complete ban on alcohol advertising and smoking in public places, welcomed the traffic light coding proposals.

But Dr Vivienne Nathanson, head of science and ethics at the BMA, was disappointed not to see a total ban on smoking in enclosed public places.

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"If this is the case, he [John Reid] will be letting down every infant, child and adult in England," she said.

Deborah Arnott, of Action on Smoking and Health (Ash), said the proposals might be unworkable.

"We know from Ireland that what makes a ban work is to have a simple, level playing field where you can't smoke in any workplaces."

Pro-smoking campaigners said businesses should be allowed to choose the policy that best suited their staff and customers.

Forest director Simon Clark said most people would be happy with more no-smoking areas and better ventilation.

"They do not want a complete ban on public smoking enforced by an army of tobacco control officers," he said.

"We support further restrictions but we vehemently oppose what has become a systematic attempt to demonise smokers and their perfectly legal habit."

The opposition parties were also sceptical of the impact the government's reforms will have.

Liberal Democrat health spokesman Paul Burstow said: "The test for the white paper will be whether it delivers on smoking and diet. Both require more than just warm words.

"Without a comprehensive ban on smoking in enclosed public places, staff will still be exposed to the unacceptable risk of second-hand smoke."

Shadow Health Secretary Andrew Lansley said the Tories would achieve more and do it more quickly by working with the industry to achieve a "smoke-free environment in the great majority of pubs and restauarants and public places."

He added the junk food advertising ban would not work.

"What we need in public health are evidence-based solutions instead of talk."

i cant wait :)

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aye, good news...I cam back from the maple gig in glasgow, stinking of smoke all the way home, too late to shower (3am) and my pillow stinks too (changed).

It fucks me off that 30% of the populus dictates that we should suffer the bad side of smoking (sure, you smokers love it, makes you feel great, 1st hand).

how come smoking has such a hold on people ( not the adiction, but the NEED, the "RIGHT" to smoke ?)

it's fucking stinking, bad for your and my health, so fuck off to your private FUG (at home) and let everyone else get on with "smelling each other" (a piss poor argument for not banning the fucking cancer stick).

"pubs are a natural haven for smokers", exactly, why is that ? because its always been ?...so, ahh...no reason to change that then.

half the fuckers here looking to "save the right of an antisocial (sic) few" are on here trying to ban the NF march (last time I heard, watching a bunch of moron right wingers never killed anyone because of the fumes they give off)...granted, they might kick someone's head in for being "the wrong colour", but that's a different matter.

bahhhhhhh...

My Wife can't come and see maple play, as she's asthmatic, and can't stand the fug, Murray's wife couldn't come to the CD launch as she's pregnant and is no way going to sit in a FUG for 4 hours.

so , fuck you smokers, it's time for the non-smokers to get as selfish as you, and say "fuck off". at least we only kill people with boredom and whining (bill hicks).

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Guest tv tanned
(last time I heard' date=' watching a bunch of moron right wingers never killed anyone because of the fumes they give off)[/quote']

But they DO stink something rotten, phew

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i think it'll be great

cos i've been trying to stop for about a year or something...

i managed to stop at work

and i'm getting better when i'm at home

but as soon as i go out its just too easy

if someone was like NO dont do that

then i'd be all like.. oh.. ok

then eventually the temptations will be taken away

and i'll be cured!

:woohoo:

personally i think you should have to be 18 or even 21 to buy any smoking materials

and also booze

people are always saying how we're all unhealthy and stuff

so why dont they actively go out and put a stop to it?

kids wouldnt be roaming with streets with bottles of white lightning and a pack a lammy bammies min - cos every single shop would say 'are you 21?' and they'd be like... er.. well... um...

HA!

so i guess either crime would go up

or people would be more constuctive with their time...

hmm...

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aye' date=' good news...I cam back from the maple gig in glasgow, stinking of

so , fuck you smokers, it's time for the non-smokers to get as selfish as you, and say "fuck off". at least we only kill people with boredom and whining (bill hicks).[/quote']

well said that man - there is nothing worse getting a fag burn in your clothes, having streaming eyes, having clothes stinking and generally feeling unhealthy after being in a pub / venue.

Dave

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I also want to emphasise the piss poor argument that business will go bust, it's oh so typical of people to only see SHORT TERM effects. it may take a few years before non smokers go "oh, they really have stopped smoke in pubs, I can go out and enjoy a night on the town now, I'll start doing that more often"...

but no no, 6 months is "forever" these days, and as we know, thanks to sir Walter Ralegh, bringing the lovely tobacco over the seas, smoking has been ingrained in our history as a rite of passage, or necessity of a Pub's "atmosphere". So, fuck yee off yee darned non smoker (its in the magnacarta)

it does all boil down to "individuals rites", but the overwhelming "winning argument" is that the rite of a non smoker is denied by a smoker, as he/she exhales smoke (bad for everyone, proven). The right of a smoker is denied, if this plan goes a head, but it's actually good for them, not to smoke, or be subjugated to second hand smoke. If the argument is about individual rites, then the result of the individuals choice should not cause damage to others, and the last time I checked, breathing out is ok, but breathing out carcinogens is not.

If pub landlords were that worried about losing their business, then why not splash out and get those extractor fans they could have done, and this whole sorry issue probably wouldn't be around today.

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Guest tv tanned

smokers rights are already restricted anyway, hospitals, public transport etc.

they're not being stopped from smoking, merely further restricted in where they can indulge.

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smokers rights are already restricted anyway' date=' hospitals, public transport etc.

they're not being stopped from smoking, merely further restricted in where they can indulge.[/quote']

When Gabi (my wife) was in Hospital, with a bad asthma attack, when she was allowed to walk around (after 2 days on a drip in bed), she couldn't help but see all the other asthma nutters who smoked...standing outside with their portable drips...puffing away.

and people get fucked off with the NHS not having money...("oh, but we (smokers) pay more tax to fund the health service"...suck my dick).

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Guest tv tanned

True story #2 while at SNP Conference in September I wandered into the bar to get a pint, and there was a woman sitting with a fag in one hand and an asthma inhaler in the other. I shit ye not!

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Yes smokers feel they have a right to smoke, but we also have the right not to breath it all in (and to smell like s*** for days!). So smoke at home... smoke in the open air (if you have to), smoke down at the beach, smoke in your gardens, etc etc. This legislation is not telling people to stop smoking, or that smoking is illegal, but simply in pubs/clubs/restaraunts. Might even help people cut down! People often choose to see the short term.. but in the long term I think this is a bold step that can only be a good thing.

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