The privacy debate

[britheguy]

I think most people are getting hooked on what this guy said...when I think Milner is getting at the fact that it's got to the stage in our sad world of PC we can't say stuff in our own home etc in what we think is privacy.

 

Is this the same as 'phone tapping'?

Is it the same as being tagged on Facebook in some sleazy pole dancing club with a half naked woman on your knee and your girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/husband/mother/father etc seeing it and giving you shit for it. Of course you could claim that you are old enough to do what you want...however I don't think that will wash in a divorce court, or when you're 'grounded' Will you be happy then and say the person had a right to post the picture.

 

Forget about the guy in the link and answer the question......is it okay for someone to record a private conversation and use it against that person. Or even better...would it be okay for someone to record you saying something in private, without you knowing and using it against you?

 

Edited May 1, 2014 by britheguy

[The Milner]

I think most people are getting hooked on what this guy said...when I think Milner is getting at the fact that it's got to the stage in our sad world of PC we can't say stuff in our own home etc in what we think is privacy.

 

Is this the same as 'phone tapping'?

Is it the same as being tagged on Facebook in some sleazy pole dancing club with a half naked woman on your knee and your girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/husband/mother/father etc seeing it and giving you shit for it. Of course you could claim that you are old enough to do what you want...however I don't think that will wash in a divorce court, or when you're 'grounded' Will you be happy then and say the person had a right to post the picture.

 

Forget about the guy in the link and answer the question......is it okay for someone to record a private conversation and use it against that person. Or even better...would it be okay for someone to record you saying something in private, without you knowing and using it against you?

 

Thank you! I really didnt want to get hung up on the racism thing as it really wasnt the point of the question. 

[Moon Moon]

Personally, it should be abolished if used in the likes of civil courts and that and for small cases in sherif court. Obviously it should be allowed for crimes that are actually worth the Hastle like murder or rape.

what do people think about police being able to bug your house without your consent?

[Gladstone]

I'm sort of down the middle on a lot if this.

Generally, if you're not a dick or don't commit crimes etc. people aren't going to invade your privacy and hold what they find against you.

I'm such a stand up guy that I'm never in danger of this affecting me.

[colb]

 

I think most people are getting hooked on what this guy said...when I think Milner is getting at the fact that it's got to the stage in our sad world of PC we can't say stuff in our own home etc in what we think is privacy.

 

Is this the same as 'phone tapping'?

Is it the same as being tagged on Facebook in some sleazy pole dancing club with a half naked woman on your knee and your girlfriend/wife/boyfriend/husband/mother/father etc seeing it and giving you shit for it. Of course you could claim that you are old enough to do what you want...however I don't think that will wash in a divorce court, or when you're 'grounded' Will you be happy then and say the person had a right to post the picture.

 

Forget about the guy in the link and answer the question......is it okay for someone to record a private conversation and use it against that person. Or even better...would it be okay for someone to record you saying something in private, without you knowing and using it against you?

I'd be pretty fucking embarrassed if some of the things I say in private were published or available for all to hear - but I wouldn't be worried that people would think I was racist/sexist/homophobic/bigoted, because I don't talk like that.

It's a fact of life that we now live in public, moaning about PC and privacy isn't going to change that. If you don't want to take the risk of people thinking you're racist/sexist/homophobic/bigoted or getting tagged in a facebook post in a lap dancers it's easy enough - try not to say or do things you'd be ashamed of if you were caught.

Edited May 1, 2014 by colb

[The Milner]

So should we not expect any privacy any more? We should always be on guard with every single thing we say or do, even in our own private homes, just incase? 

 

Is that acceptable to people, as long as every now and again it outs another racist or homophobe? 

[Alkaline]

I think you should accept that you should be held accountable for what you say whether in private or not, if you can't justify it don't say it.

[Gladstone]

So should we not expect any privacy any more? We should always be on guard with every single thing we say or do, even in our own private homes, just incase? 

 

Is that acceptable to people, as long as every now and again it outs another racist or homophobe? 

That's not really what I'm saying to be honest.

 

I find it hard to get worked up about it because I tend to not act like a dick or say offensive things in private anyway.  Things I say or do aren't going to come back to bite me on the arse.

 

I'd probably think differently if I conducted myself completely differently in private, but I don't.  It's not a case of "being on guard" 24/7 - more a case of just not needing to be on guard because I don't say homophobic / racist / offensive things in private anyway.

[colb]

 

So should we not expect any privacy any more? We should always be on guard with every single thing we say or do, even in our own private homes, just incase? 

 

Is that acceptable to people, as long as every now and again it outs another racist or homophobe?

 

Why would you have to be on guard? Surely just being a normal decent human being will rule out much chance of this happening?

And yeah it's pretty acceptable to me. I don't think that the government will ever have the manpower to do more than scan for trigger words, and I don't do any illegal stuff so it's not a big deal.

Edited May 1, 2014 by colb

[The Milner]

It doesnt have to be illegal stuff, what this guy said wasnt technically illegal, although morally wrong. Should you always be on guard, even if your not talking about illegal stuff, just incase what you said has been recorded without you knowing? 

[Old Gold]

I've seen the words 'these days' too many times in this thread. The tape recorder isn't a new invention, and before that there was eavesdropping. You should by now be aware that most people's phones can record audio.

Not being able to say whatever bullshit you like in private with zero risk of consequence is not a new phenomenon.

Edited May 1, 2014 by Old Gold

[TR!ΔNGL€ T€€TH]

I hate it when there a consequences to the dreadful things I say.

[Monster Zero]

I dislike the idea of my privacy being invaded but not because I think I have anything to hide, it just feels a bit Big Brother. In the case of this buffoon, it seems like poetic justice that he has been removed from his position after earning a fortune from a sport that has such a huge black presence but behind the scenes he was disparaging about black people.

[Skubbs]

Isn't racism illegal?  I thought you could go to court for saying racially motivated insults?

[The Milner]

Directly being racist, yes, telling your girl friend you dont want her to hang around with black people is not illegal. 

[scottyboy]

The US is probably different, anyway, because it has stronger freedom of speech laws (though not sure of the details).

[The Milner]

Even then, i'm not sure that over here you could be done for telling someone you would prefer them not speaking to a certain ethnic race. You could be done if you arranged a public gathering to spread that ideal id imagine.

[britheguy]

Surprising to hear a few people stating they never say anything wrong/offensive whether in private or not. What Saints we have in Aberdeen Music.

What one person finds offensive, another might not. Drinking....anybody on here drink? Probably! Yet some people find it offensive. How about smoking, how about taking drugs, how about reading the Playboy mag. All these things and more can be seen as wrong or/and offensive to someone out there. To say you 'never' say or doing something wrong/offensive is a pretty big statement.

 

I think we need to look at is that it's one thing to not do something out of choice.....but another to have the freedom to make that choice taken away from you.

[colb]

Surprising to hear a few people stating they never say anything wrong/offensive whether in private or not. What Saints we have in Aberdeen Music.

What one person finds offensive, another might not. Drinking....anybody on here drink? Probably! Yet some people find it offensive. How about smoking, how about taking drugs, how about reading the Playboy mag. All these things and more can be seen as wrong or/and offensive to someone out there. To say you 'never' say or doing something wrong/offensive is a pretty big statement.

 

I think we need to look at is that it's one thing to not do something out of choice.....but another to have the freedom to make that choice taken away from you.

I'm comfortable with people not having the choice to be racist/sexist/homophobic/bigoted.

Comparing hate speech to drinking and smoking is silly and makes you sound like Jeremy Clarkson.

[britheguy]

I'm comfortable with people not having the choice to be racist/sexist/homophobic/bigoted.

Comparing hate speech to drinking and smoking is silly and makes you sound like Jeremy Clarkson.

Okay so you've brought up the racist card again even though I've made no mention of it in my post .My point was that there are a lot of things that are offensive to some, but not to others.

 

Now we can agree on something...Hate speech is not good and should be handled in a severe manner whether that speech is in UK, USA, Russia, or any other country. However to remind you once again.....this thread is not about racism or hate speech, it's about two people talking in private, and whether it's acceptable for that conversation to be recorded

[Old Gold]

I can completely understand that some people hate having their privacy violated by social media, etc - my point is that it's not really a debate, just a fact of living in society.  It's gossip and word-of-mouth with cold evidence.  It's not a particularly new phenomenon.

 

Is it arguably more of a problem that people can be so hypocritical and closeted?  Putting an end to that is a lot more progressive and realistic than requiring a license for a tape recorder.  I'm not exactly the purest human being, but I'm not ashamed of anything I do in my house.  Frankly, I'm confident that the person filming proceedings would be more likely to be viewed as a pervert than me.  On the other hand, if you're cheating on your wife, waving your cock and balls about on the internet when it's something you wouldn't want your son or daughter viewing, smoking crack after agreeing to a contract that said you wouldn't, or leading a person to think the sun shines out of their arse when they're a cunt, maybe the main issue is that people are still pretending that their marriage is the bees knees and sucking up to their bosses.

[Surfer_Rosa]

I think most people here agree that secretly recording someone without their knowledge is a shitty thing to do. Although it can't be too surprising that a young mistress of an old racist billionaire has dubious morals.

However the his fine and ban are a different matter. I think it would be wrong for the NBA to just turn a blind eye once the recording was out in the public domain. Nobody is calling for him to get locked up or remove his freedom of choice. But regardless of how they were presented to the public, his comments damaged the team and the entire organisation so it's their freedom to choose to cease his involvement.

[scottyboy]

Okay so you've brought up the racist card again even though I've made no mention of it in my post .My point was that there are a lot of things that are offensive to some, but not to others.

 

Now we can agree on something...Hate speech is not good and should be handled in a severe manner whether that speech is in UK, USA, Russia, or any other country. However to remind you once again.....this thread is not about racism or hate speech, it's about two people talking in private, and whether it's acceptable for that conversation to be recorded

 

The other things you mentioned, with the possible exception of (illegal) drugs, wouldn't bring down the same ton of bricks, though. No one would bother if you were "caught" consuming alcohol; you'd have to be either an alcoholic or drinking on the job, or some such. 

[colb]

Okay so you've brought up the racist card again even though I've made no mention of it in my post .My point was that there are a lot of things that are offensive to some, but not to others. Now we can agree on something...Hate speech is not good and should be handled in a severe manner whether that speech is in UK, USA, Russia, or any other country. However to remind you once again.....this thread is not about racism or hate speech, it's about two people talking in private, and whether it's acceptable for that conversation to be recorded

The conversation is going to be recorded whether people think it's acceptable or not. The choice is whether to behave like a decent human being or not. Your point was a heavy handed response to some of us saying we don't speak in a certain way, so bringing it back to racism seems a natural turn of conversation to me.

It's not up to you to decide what a thread is about, for me this is a pretty clear cut choice between agreeing that it's ok to say or think things as long as no one finds out, or that people who say silly things are perfectly fair game to be pulled up for saying them.

In the UK we have no real right to privacy in common law so I guess right now we're all fair game.....

[Teabags]

Eavesdroppping and recording private conversations is a bit of a shitty thing to do. Doubt it's criminal though. If it is, then surely CCTV and audio recording devices outside of pubs are as well.

 

However, the guy's a cunt and deserves it. Woebetide that he stands to make about $400m+ on the sale of the team. Fuck him.