Most overrated bands/artists ever?

[Indigo_Soul]

Slipknot - These type of bands really piss me off, especially these guys!, I have the ability to shout into a mic, look at me!!!!whoop de fuckin doo!!

Korn - pretty much the same.

Bowling for soup/blink 182/good charlotte etc etc(fuck of you bunch of twats, High school muppet bands)

Metallica(simply because every uncool kid on the planet likes them!!)

Nirvana(i wish kurt shot himself before he made an album!)

im also tempted to say...The killers, The datsuns, The Thrills, The Zutons, The Libertines!! and Franz Fucking Ferdinand!!! all these bands have at the most 2 good songs on their album!!you know it's true!

and who the hell said the rolling stones????

thats made me feel a whole lot better, i thankyou.

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

Necro has some nice lyrics but he rated more as a producer because he is a real good producer. ill Bill and Sabac are two of Necros artists under his lable. Both have cd's in stores NOW. 2 of the best white rappers out there.

You'd be hard pushed to find any Necro albums in the shops or any stuff from his Psyko+Logical Records label, the albums he's produced by Sabac Red, Ill Bill and Mr Hyde as far as i know are only available on import, i ain't ever seen them in One Up or Fopp...

Necro is a decent producer, he did some sterling work with Cage on the Agent Orange/Radiohead record, Agent Orange especially with that great Walter Carlos sample from A Clockwork Orange but his style is very samey at times, its like he is making music for horror-based computer games all the time a lot but nevertheless i love tracks he's reworked and resleazed like Get On Your Knees and I Need Drugs(a nice spin on LL Cool J's I Need Love)...

His videos are worth seeing though, certainly not Top Of The Pops or CD:UK material i tell ya that...

I will recommend to anyone to buy Cage's "Movies For The Blind", Non Phixion's "The Future Is Now", Copywrite's "The High Exhaulted", EL-P's "Fantastic Damage", Edan's "Primitive Plus" and MHz's "Table Scraps" if you want to hear some good underground rap by white rappers...

[bryn]

steve vai.

In what way though??

Steve Vai solo album sales is something like 2 million for a 20 year period. i.e - not that much at all. He is one of the best musicians in the world, its absurd to say he's overrated.

p.s sorry to drag up this thread

[...mole...]

In what way though??

Steve Vai solo album sales is something like 2 million for a 20 year period. i.e - not that much at all. He is one of the best musicians in the world' date=' its absurd to say he's overrated.

p.s sorry to drag up this thread [/quote']

steve vai is also excellent live he just looks like hes enjoying himself alot on stage

seen him at G3 this year steve vai + billy sheehan couldnt of went wrong, satch and fripp were excellent as well

[slinkmasif]

Overrated by whom?

Fuck, why should a band be rated anyway. I don't think write music be be judged. I would hope not anyway. This thread is overrated!

[bryn]

steve vai is also excellent live he just looks like hes enjoying himself alot on stage

seen him at G3 this year steve vai + billy sheehan couldnt of went wrong' date=' satch and fripp were excellent as well[/quote']

I'm still grumbling I missed that show!

I have Vai live at the Astoria with billy sheehan. Incredible showmanship, at one point Vai has lasers strapped to his fingers - pretty impressive when he's playing at 25 notes per second!

[...mole...]

I'm still grumbling I missed that show!

I have Vai live at the Astoria with billy sheehan. Incredible showmanship' date=' at one point Vai has lasers strapped to his fingers - pretty impressive when he's playing at 25 notes per second! [/quote']

yea ive got that DVD as well tis very ace havent watched it all yet though

[Larsen B]

Fuck' date=' why should a band be rated anyway. I don't think write music be be judged. I would hope not anyway. This thread is overrated! [/quote']

Stuff you.

[ray@ladymercedes]

Re:

pretty much every band with any sort of record deal or popularity' date=' with the exception of every band i like. that is to say, if i don't like them they are fucking shit.[/quote']

Seems to be the opinion of everyone on here don't ya think?

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

Fabricated? Neither The Clash or the Pistols were in any way manufactured. And pretend punks? *shakes head*

Read my post again' date=' i never said the Pistols were fabricated but some people seem to think Malcolm McLaren got a hold of four teenagers from London, dressed them up in ripped clothes, dyed their hair and told them to write Anarchy In The UK, which is load of bollocks...albeit McLaren did have an influence over their look and image to an extent.

How were they not pretend punks? have you heard the 101'ers?, Strummer wasn't singing about anything remotely political when he was doing his pub rock stuff with the 101'ers way back when the Pistols burst on the scene nor was he wearing any slogan-covered shirts at the time, he jumped on a bandwagon just like a lot of people did at that time, there's a huge gulf of difference between what Strummer was doing in the 101'ers and what he would eventually do with the Clash...

Pretty funny how Strummer went from wearing teddy boy clothes and looking more like Shakin Stevens and singing the kind of rock n roll Eddie Cochran would sing and changed his entire image and attitude after seeing the Pistols play don't ya think?

They weren't manufactured but their image was totally fabricated, it wasn't their own idea to wear the shirts that were based on the slogan-adorned shirts they'd seen in photos of French situationist groups, they became almost as bad for being clothes-horses as the Pistols were.

You'll no doubt disagree with me and hit me with some of that profound punk knowledge you bestowed upon me once about The Damned supposedly inventing spitting...i must admit i had no idea they'd done that, i imagine the likes of Alexander Graham Bell and John Logie Baird must be slapping their heads in heaven thinking "fuck me, why didn't i think of inventing spitting? i must be a bigger moron than Rat Scabies!"

Regarding The Clash's output - sure, a lotta their material (from and including London Calling) was appalling. But their debut full length + Give 'em Enough Rope? Well, that's another matter.

Their eponymous album is faultless i think but Give 'Em Enough Rope ain't a flawless album, has some decent tracks on it but i think it'd be silly to say that everything The Clash recorded was fucking gold.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Read my post again' date=' i never said the Pistols were fabricated but some people seem to think Malcolm McLaren got a hold of four teenagers from London, dressed them up in ripped clothes, dyed their hair and told them to write Anarchy In The UK, which is load of bollocks...albeit McLaren did have an influence over their look and image to an extent.

How were they not pretend punks? have you heard the 101'ers?, Strummer wasn't singing about anything remotely political when he was doing his pub rock stuff with the 101'ers way back when the Pistols burst on the scene nor was he wearing any slogan-covered shirts at the time, he jumped on a bandwagon just like a lot of people did at that time, there's a huge gulf of difference between what Strummer was doing in the 101'ers and what he would eventually do with the Clash...

Pretty funny how Strummer went from wearing teddy boy clothes and looking more like Shakin Stevens and singing the kind of rock n roll Eddie Cochran would sing and changed his entire image and attitude after seeing the Pistols play don't ya think?

They weren't manufactured but their image was totally fabricated, it wasn't their own idea to wear the shirts that were based on the slogan-adorned shirts they'd seen in photos of French situationist groups, they became almost as bad for being clothes-horses as the Pistols were.

You'll no doubt disagree with me and hit me with some of that profound punk knowledge you bestowed upon me once about The Damned supposedly inventing spitting...i must admit i had no idea they'd done that, i imagine the likes of Alexander Graham Bell and John Logie Baird must be slapping their heads in heaven thinking "fuck me, why didn't i think of inventing spitting? i must be a bigger moron than Rat Scabies!"

[/quote']

McLaren having a hand in what clothing the Pistol's wore? As I said earlier in another posting (I guessed you missed it), Rotten and co formed a close attachment with Sex - Westwood and McLaren's shop. They used to, prior to the Pistols coming together, hang out there. So, it is then hardly surprising that they often wore Vivienne Westwood's designs.

Strummer, while a member of pub rockers the 101ers, was not then aware of punk. When he caught The Clash, his life was changed, just as many other people's lives changed when they first caught the Pistols. So jumping on the bandwagon? Not at all. Inspired? Excited? Yes.

Regarding The Clash wearing Jackson Pollock inspired clothing, clothing adorned with slogans - can I ask you whose idea it was to wear such clothes? Bernie Rhodes? No. No one.

Regarding The Damned inventing spitting - it is indeed true. Siouxsie despised the band for this very reason. Do you, as you appear to, believe that I just made this up?

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

McLaren having a hand in what clothing the Pistol's wore? As I said earlier in another posting (I guessed you missed it)' date=' Rotten and co formed a close attachment with Sex - Westwood and McLaren's shop. They used to, prior to the Pistols coming together, hang out there. So, it is then hardly surprising that they often wore Vivienne Westwood's designs.[/quote']

I am well aware of the Sex Pistols story squire, they're my favourite band of all-time, there's not much i don't know about them or their story.

Strummer, while a member of pub rockers the 101ers, was not then aware of punk. When he caught The Clash, his life was changed, just as many other people's lives changed when they first caught the Pistols. So jumping on the bandwagon? Not at all. Inspired? Excited? Yes.

Possibly but nevertheless, a bandwagon began when the Pistols came on the scene and singlehandedly created the punk rock scene in the UK, you can't deny that.

I just found it funny that one minute Strummer is poncing about onstage in pubs with a quiff and sideburns and wearing drainpipe jackets and pulling Chuck Berry poses with his guitar and singing about keys to your heart and what not and the next, he is this socialist rhetoric-spewing crewcut-headed punk rocker singing about being bored with the U.S.A when he was singing 50s style rock n roll songs and looking like a teddyboy only a few months earlier...

Call me cynical if you will...i just didn't find The Clash to be as genuine a band as they made out to be...i am just going by stories that i have read and told to me as well...

Strummer also then later claimed to be into reggae and said he had been inspired by the music he had been hearing in reggae and dub clubs around London whilst Don Letts basically said that was crap and Letts and most of the regulars he knew from DJing in such clubs had no knowledge of Strummer even visiting such clubs but most of them knew that Lydon was a regular to such places because he was heavily into artists like Burning Spear and King Tubby...

I worked down in London for a bit and spoke with a guy who used to pop into the office of a magazine i was doing work experience with for a few months, he was an ex member of a punk band you might know of called Cocksparrow and he told me a shitload of stories about the punk scene in London at the time and the 100 Club one Wednesday lunchtime in a nearby pub and i remember he was very highly critical of The Clash and said The Clash were a bunch of fucking snobs who were barely around the scene as much as you would think or were led to believe by the amount of shit thats written about them and the only thing they were interested in was overtaking the Pistols as the premier punk band in London but he said despite all that, they were still a cracking band when they played live...thats his words, not mine by the way before you comment

Regarding The Clash wearing Jackson Pollock inspired clothing, clothing adorned with slogans - can I ask you whose idea it was to wear such clothes? Bernie Rhodes? No. No one.

He probably didn't tell them which clothes to wear but as any manager would do though, he'd probably advise them on what image to project to the public in order to market themselves better or market themselves more effectively...

A classic example would be Malcolm McLaren advising the Pistols to take Sid Vicious onboard after they fired Glenn Matlock to emphasise and alleviate their public image more, depending on which story is indeed true as there are so many sides to the Pistols story, its difficult to actually get a clear picture of what went on behind the scenes during that turbulent time in their career...

Regarding The Damned inventing spitting - it is indeed true. Siouxsie despised the band for this very reason. Do you, as you appear to, believe that I just made this up?

Do you have proof to say that The Damned did invent such phlegmatic emissions?

My original point when we spoke about this wasn't about the invention of spitting at all but the media's reaction to it and how they made it seem like a culture amongst punks, they cottoned on to Johnny Rotten emptying mucus from his nostrils and spitting onstage when the Pistols were starting to get more and more media attention, which Lydon says was to clear his throat and not to invent any form of saliva-spattered culture amongst the punk rock movement at all, he said himself the media were the ones who cottoned on to all that crap and made a meal out of it all when it really wasn't anything to do with punk at all but merely a natural thing singers would do onstage anyway...

That was what i was getting at, i wasn't interested in finding any gob-soaked stigma attached to which punk band inventing such a culture at all...

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I am well aware of the Sex Pistols story squire' date=' they're my favourite band of all-time, there's not much i don't know about them or their story.

Possibly but nevertheless, a bandwagon began when the Pistols came on the scene and singlehandedly created the punk rock scene in the UK, you can't deny that.

I just found it funny that one minute Strummer is poncing about onstage in pubs with a quiff and sideburns and wearing drainpipe jackets and pulling Chuck Berry poses with his guitar and singing about keys to your heart and what not and the next, he is this socialist rhetoric-spewing crewcut-headed punk rocker singing about being bored with the U.S.A when he was singing 50s style rock n roll songs and looking like a teddyboy only a few months earlier...

Call me cynical if you will...i just didn't find The Clash to be as genuine a band as they made out to be...i am just going by stories that i have read and told to me as well...

Strummer also then later claimed to be into reggae and said he had been inspired by the music he had been hearing in reggae and dub clubs around London whilst Don Letts basically said that was crap and Letts and most of the regulars he knew from DJing in such clubs had no knowledge of Strummer even visiting such clubs but most of them knew that Lydon was a regular to such places because he was heavily into artists like Burning Spear and King Tubby...

I worked down in London for a bit and spoke with a guy who used to pop into the office of a magazine i was doing work experience with for a few months, he was an ex member of a punk band you might know of called Cocksparrow and he told me a shitload of stories about the punk scene in London at the time and the 100 Club one Wednesday lunchtime in a nearby pub and i remember he was very highly critical of The Clash and said The Clash were a bunch of fucking snobs who were barely around the scene as much as you would think or were led to believe by the amount of shit thats written about them and the only thing they were interested in was overtaking the Pistols as the premier punk band in London but he said despite all that, they were still a cracking band when they played live...thats his words, not mine by the way before you comment

He probably didn't tell them which clothes to wear but as any manager would do though, he'd probably advise them on what image to project to the public in order to market themselves better or market themselves more effectively...

A classic example would be Malcolm McLaren advising the Pistols to take Sid Vicious onboard after they fired Glenn Matlock to emphasise and alleviate their public image more, depending on which story is indeed true as there are so many sides to the Pistols story, its difficult to actually get a clear picture of what went on behind the scenes during that turbulent time in their career...

Do you have proof to say that The Damned did invent such phlegmatic emissions?

My original point when we spoke about this wasn't about the invention of spitting at all but the media's reaction to it and how they made it seem like a culture amongst punks, they cottoned on to Johnny Rotten emptying mucus from his nostrils and spitting onstage when the Pistols were starting to get more and more media attention, which Lydon says was to clear his throat and not to invent any form of saliva-spattered culture amongst the punk rock movement at all, he said himself the media were the ones who cottoned on to all that crap and made a meal out of it all when it really wasn't anything to do with punk at all but merely a natural thing singers would do onstage anyway...

That was what i was getting at, i wasn't interested in finding any gob-soaked stigma attached to which punk band inventing such a culture at all...[/quote']

The Sex Pistols did indeed create UK punk rock. But as I've said, bandwagon jumping (regarding the scene they would inspire) played no real part. Folks such as Howard Devoto and others, were already extremely disillusioned with rock music of the time. Seeing the Pistols catalyzed these feelings of disenchantment, exciting them. They saw that they too could make change.

Yes, I know Cock Sparrer. Seminal oi outfit, though cannot comment on the views expressed.

Sure, many have seen the band's politics as a sham. The Damned slammed The Clash for this very reason. Crass were extremely critical of The Clash. Suggest you check out songs White Punks On Hope and System from Crass' second full length Stations Of The Crass.

As a manager Rhodes would have advised them as to what image to project, suggesting more effective ways in which to market them? Hey, this is punk rock, not Pop Stars.

The recruitment of Sid to increase their public profile? I cannot see what proof there is of this. It is said he was taken on board as he'd beaten up The Old Grey Whistle Test's Bob Harris.

Regarding proof of The Damned having invented spitting - well, I think Siouxsie's word carries some weight don't you?

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

Yes' date=' I know Cock Sparrer. Seminal oi outfit, though cannot comment on the views expressed.[/quote']

I never even heard of Cocksparrer/Cocksparrow/whatever they're called when he mentioned he was in them, the only reason we got into such a conversation was cos i was wearing my Sex Pistols God Save The Queen t-shirt that day and he said "you a fan of them? best band ever mate, seen em more times than i can count", the guy was a mate of the editor of Front Magazine(whom i was working with for about two and a half months) and worked as a producer for various shows on Talk Radio UK(or TalkSport as its called now) and he seemed to have a lot of first-hand knowledge of the scene at the time and knew all the faces who were around the scene such as Shane MacGowan(another hero of mine), Billy Idol, Adam Ant, Don Letts, Jimmy Pursey etc and it was fascinating to hear the stories from someone who was there and saw it with his own eyes, he told us that Mick Jagger and Jimmy Page were also queueing outside some of the gigs to get in to two of the Pistols gigs he was going to.

He told me another couple of stories about the Finsbury Park Pistols gig as well and some altercation he had with Liam Gallagher, he knew Alan McGee and was talking away to him and Liam was being a knob-end and they got into scuffle. He knows quite a lot of people because he works as a producer so he knew a lot of bands from working at radio stations around London, i wouldn't question the authenticity of what he said, he seemed pretty real to me and he was in his late 40s so it does kinda add up i guess.

The recruitment of Sid to increase their public profile? I cannot see what proof there is of this. It is said he was taken on board as he'd beaten up The Old Grey Whistle Test's Bob Harris.

Well we're maybe reading different books about the Pistols, he certainly wasn't taken on for his superb bass playing and songwriting techniques put it that way.

Regarding proof of The Damned having invented spitting - well, I think Siouxsie's word carries some weight don't you?

Regardless of who threw the first spit - The Damned or The Sex Pistols, cos lets face it, we're never gonna be able to turn the clock back now and see if it was Rat Scabies or John Lydon who gobbed first, it was the Sex Pistols who got the most media attention for their spitting onstage, which the crowds and media picked up on and thought it was a term of endearment or a component of punk culture.

[Guest Jake Wifebeater]

Hmmm' date=' you all seem to be mentioning bands I've never heard of. How can they be over-rated? How dare someone say Queens Of The Stoneage!!

My list has to be:

Metallica (Since ....And Justice For All)

Slayer (Never liked them. The new stuff sound like the old stuff)

Cradle of Filth (Since The Principle of Evil Made Flesh)

Slipknot (Nu-metal wank)

'A'

Soil

Bad Religion (Since Recipe for Hate) - Jake's bound to disagree

The Distillers (ucccchhhh)

Hole

Jane's Addiction[/quote']

I agree with you 100% about Bad Religion, but why did you think I'd disagree?

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I never even heard of Cocksparrer/Cocksparrow/whatever they're called when he mentioned he was in them' date=' the only reason we got into such a conversation was cos i was wearing my Sex Pistols God Save The Queen t-shirt that day and he said "you a fan of them? best band ever mate, seen em more times than i can count", the guy was a mate of the editor of Front Magazine(whom i was working with for about two and a half months) and worked as a producer for various shows on Talk Radio UK(or TalkSport as its called now) and he seemed to have a lot of first-hand knowledge of the scene at the time and knew all the faces who were around the scene such as Shane MacGowan(another hero of mine), Billy Idol, Adam Ant, Don Letts, Jimmy Pursey etc and it was fascinating to hear the stories from someone who was there and saw it with his own eyes, he told us that Mick Jagger and Jimmy Page were also queueing outside some of the gigs to get in to two of the Pistols gigs he was going to.

He told me another couple of stories about the Finsbury Park Pistols gig as well and some altercation he had with Liam Gallagher, he knew Alan McGee and was talking away to him and Liam was being a knob-end and they got into scuffle. He knows quite a lot of people because he works as a producer so he knew a lot of bands from working at radio stations around London, i wouldn't question the authenticity of what he said, he seemed pretty real to me and he was in his late 40s so it does kinda add up i guess.

Well we're maybe reading different books about the Pistols, he certainly wasn't taken on for his superb bass playing and songwriting techniques put it that way.

Regardless of who threw the first spit - The Damned or The Sex Pistols, cos lets face it, we're never gonna be able to turn the clock back now and see if it was Rat Scabies or John Lydon who gobbed first, it was the Sex Pistols who got the most media attention for their spitting onstage, which the crowds and media picked up on and thought it was a term of endearment or a component of punk culture.[/quote']

The Finsbury Park show 1996? The Pistols were by this point a buncha washed up losers. Lydon hadn't produced anything worthy of a listen since Public Image Limited's third full length Flowers Of Romance. Jones, Cook and Matlock were equally as embarrassing.

While I'd certainly no intention of attending the show, I was outside (with others) distributing Anti-Election Alliance literature.

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

The Finsbury Park show 1996? The Pistols were by this point a buncha washed up losers. Lydon hadn't produced anything worthy of a listen since Public Image Limited's third full length Flowers Of Romance.

I must admit i quite like some of the tracks on This Is What You Want, This Is What You Get, specifically The Order Of Death(the film of the same name he co-starred alongside Harvey Keitel is utter shit though and a total embarrassment) and This Is Not A Love Song but i don't think Lydon has done anything musically noteworthy since he collaborated with Leftfield on Open Up.

They did the Filthy Lucre Tour for their own reasons i guess, didn't surprise or bother me either way, one thing you can never take away from them is the influence and inspiration they gave to so many bands and the amount of subcultures they gave rise to in this country, if they want to make some money from doing arena or stadium gigs then fair play to them, thats their prerogative but of course, a band that reforms after 20 years are never gonna be what they were like the first time round are they?

To be honest, i would've preferred the original Public Image to reform than the Pistols cos i would say that i actually prefer listening to PiL than i do the Pistols at times, just because its hard to believe how fucking inventive and relevant stuff like Metal Box and Flowers Of Romance sound today.

I think tracks like Chant and Pop Tones just blow a lot of tracks he did with the Pistols completely away, it befuddles me why Metal Box never seems to make it into the top ten of essential albums charts because its such an incredible album and i doubt the likes of Lydon, Levene and Wobble will ever touch perfection like that again with any projects they've done since leaving PiL.

Regarding old punks still trying to keep themselves relevant is an argument you could apply to the likes of Iggy Pop, he hasn't made a decent album since his sojourn to Berlin to record The Idiot and Lust For Life with David Bowie in my opinion, the likes of Instinct and Brick By Brick right up to American Caesar and Naughty Little Doggie to me are just so fucking embarrassing and its no wonder he's reformed The Stooges to do some gigs...any good reason not to make him write another shitty album is a good idea i think.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I must admit i quite like some of the tracks on This Is What You Want' date=' This Is What You Get, specifically The Order Of Death(the film of the same name he co-starred alongside Harvey Keitel is utter shit though and a total embarrassment) and This Is Not A Love Song but i don't think Lydon has done anything musically noteworthy since he collaborated with Leftfield on Open Up.

They did the Filthy Lucre Tour for their own reasons i guess, didn't surprise or bother me either way, one thing you can never take away from them is the influence and inspiration they gave to so many bands and the amount of subcultures they gave rise to in this country, if they want to make some money from doing arena or stadium gigs then fair play to them, thats their prerogative but of course, a band that reforms after 20 years are never gonna be what they were like the first time round are they?

To be honest, i would've preferred the original Public Image to reform than the Pistols cos i would say that i actually prefer listening to PiL than i do the Pistols at times, just because its hard to believe how fucking inventive and relevant stuff like Metal Box and Flowers Of Romance sound today.

I think tracks like Chant and Pop Tones just blow a lot of tracks he did with the Pistols completely away, it befuddles me why Metal Box never seems to make it into the top ten of essential albums charts because its such an incredible album and i doubt the likes of Lydon, Levene and Wobble will ever touch perfection like that again with any projects they've done since leaving PiL.

Regarding old punks still trying to keep themselves relevant is an argument you could apply to the likes of Iggy Pop, he hasn't made a decent album since his sojourn to Berlin to record The Idiot and Lust For Life with David Bowie in my opinion, the likes of Instinct and Brick By Brick right up to American Caesar and Naughty Little Doggie to me are just so fucking embarrassing and its no wonder he's reformed The Stooges to do some gigs...any good reason not to make him write another shitty album is a good idea i think.[/quote']

This Is Not A Love Song? That was awful. That peroid also saw Lydon working with Ginger Baker. But certainly, Public Image Limited (with Keith Levine, a man who also served with The Clash, albeit briefly) were extremely important. Track Public Image is still, after all these years, a favourite of mine. Also, check out Jah Wobble's first full length.

What did you make of The Professionals?

Just curious, but what books on the Pistols have you read? Two I'd recommend (if you haven't already of course) would have to be photographer Ray Stevenson's Sex Pistols File + Fred and Judy Vermoral's The Real Sex Pistols. Also (whole not only about the Pistols) check out Caroline Coon's 1988.

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

Just curious' date=' but what books have you read on the Pistols? First two I picked up, and would recommend, were photographer Ray Stevenson's The Sex Pistols File and The Real Sex Pistols by Fred and Judy Vermoral. Would also recommend (while not only about the Pistols) Caroline Coon's 1988.[/quote']

Didn't catch what you said here.

I got a fucking shitload of books about the Pistols and punk rock, i even went as far to nick one of them from Front Magazine's office which was a signed copy of a Sex Pistols tour of London/memorabilia hunters book.

I got the Ray Stevenson book you mentioned above and his other book Vacant: Diary of the Punk Years, i also got the usual punk rock book suspects like the Sniffin Glue: The Essential Punk Accessory(bought that in London, have never noticed it sold here), Faber & Faber book England's Dreaming by Jon Savage, there's one i got of their ill-fated tour of America which i can't remember the name of now - its called something like 12 Days On The Road in America with The Sex Pistols, Lydon's autobiog No Blacks No Dogs No Irish, Greil Marcus' Lipstick Traces: A Secret History of the Twentieth Century, Legs McNeil's Please Kill Me(but thats more about the NY punk scene and is a bunch of New Yorkers like Richard Hell getting all uppity about British bands being hostile to them and god knows what else) and got a lot of the photography books like Destroy, Fuck You Heroes(thats one that consists mainly of NY-based bands like The Dead Boys and The Ramones) etc.

Don't have that other one you mentioned though, the one by Fred and Judy Vermoral, must check up for that one on Ebay. There's a lot of books i don't have though, there's no doubt hundreds of books about them.

I got a ton of Sex Pistols and Public Image stuff on tape and VCD as well, got an entire videography of PiL's music videos and TV appearances on DVD from a mate down in Fife as well as some old Pistols and PiL bootlegs as well as a load of documentaries about them, some even so painstaking that there's regional TV footage from some channel down in England where some local cable TV station did a documentary about the Pistols visiting Huddersfield where they played a Christmas party for kids of striking firemen, and basically the kids who were there who are now obviously adults were recalling what the Pistols were like and what the gig was like, etc etc.

Also got other books as well, i am well into The Stooges and Iggy Pop and i got some books about him, i remember one i bought a good couple of years ago now, it was by some geezer who played bass with the UK Subs, i think his name is Alvin Gibbs or something, it was largely about him being on tour with Iggy Pop during the Instinct tour. I got another one called "Real Wild Child" which had tons of pics of Stooges live shows, including that radio show where he walked on the crowd's hands and smeared himself in peanut butter. You may have seen it before.

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

What did you make of The Professionals?

The exact same thing i thought about The Rich Kids.

Shite.

By the way, did you not like the track called World Destruction that Lydon did with Afrika Bambattaa?, that was after Flowers of Romance, are you basically hating on everything PiL did after Flowers of Romance?. I think there's some individual tracks on Album that aren't too bad but nothing nearly as startling as anything on Metal Box.

Never heard much of Jah Wobble's solo stuff to be honest, i was always just into PiL, any recommendations?

[Guest Sundaram]

As the title suggests. I reckon:

Sex Pistols

I agree...

I liked them when I was 12 or something though.

[Guest The Reverend Z. Munch]

I agree...

I liked them when I was 12 or something though.

And what age did you start liking Kula Shaker?

[Guest Sundaram]

And what age did you start liking Kula Shaker?

Erm, I quite liked Tatva... cant believe that was like 7 or 8 years ago!!!

Really like Crispian Mill's guitar playing when I saw his new band at the Lemon Tree a few years back.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Didn't catch what you said here.

I got a fucking shitload of books about the Pistols and punk rock' date=' i even went as far to nick one of them from Front Magazine's office which was a signed copy of a Sex Pistols tour of London/memorabilia hunters book.

I got the Ray Stevenson book you mentioned above and his other book Vacant: Diary of the Punk Years, i also got the usual punk rock book suspects like the Sniffin Glue: The Essential Punk Accessory(bought that in London, have never noticed it sold here), Faber & Faber book England's Dreaming by Jon Savage, there's one i got of their ill-fated tour of America which i can't remember the name of now - its called something like 12 Days On The Road in America with The Sex Pistols, Lydon's autobiog No Blacks No Dogs No Irish, Greil Marcus' Lipstick Traces: A Secret History of the Twentieth Century, Legs McNeil's Please Kill Me(but thats more about the NY punk scene and is a bunch of New Yorkers like Richard Hell getting all uppity about British bands being hostile to them and god knows what else) and got a lot of the photography books like Destroy, Fuck You Heroes(thats one that consists mainly of NY-based bands like The Dead Boys and The Ramones) etc.

Don't have that other one you mentioned though, the one by Fred and Judy Vermoral, must check up for that one on Ebay. There's a lot of books i don't have though, there's no doubt hundreds of books about them.

I got a ton of Sex Pistols and Public Image stuff on tape and VCD as well, got an entire videography of PiL's music videos and TV appearances on DVD from a mate down in Fife as well as some old Pistols and PiL bootlegs as well as a load of documentaries about them, some even so painstaking that there's regional TV footage from some channel down in England where some local cable TV station did a documentary about the Pistols visiting Huddersfield where they played a Christmas party for kids of striking firemen, and basically the kids who were there who are now obviously adults were recalling what the Pistols were like and what the gig was like, etc etc.

Also got other books as well, i am well into The Stooges and Iggy Pop and i got some books about him, i remember one i bought a good couple of years ago now, it was by some geezer who played bass with the UK Subs, i think his name is Alvin Gibbs or something, it was largely about him being on tour with Iggy Pop during the Instinct tour. I got another one called "Real Wild Child" which had tons of pics of Stooges live shows, including that radio show where he walked on the crowd's hands and smeared himself in peanut butter. You may have seen it before.[/quote']

Cool.

The book by the Vermorals is I think essential, providing an insiders view of the band. All the folks involved contributed, it written when the band were still together.

I haven't read Englands Dreaming, but have heard it's very good.

Sniffin Glue: The Essential Punk Accessory? Would this be a collection of those issues Mark Perry produced?

Legs McNeil's Please Kill Me is cool.

What did you make of The Great Rock 'n' Roll Swindle? I still love that movie. Has many great moments.

What about movie DOA?

The Stooges? While I appreciate their importance in inspiring many of the early punk putfits, didn't really like them.

The geezer from the UK Subs? Yes, that would be Alvin Gibbs.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

The exact same thing i thought about The Rich Kids.

Shite.

By the way' date=' did you not like the track called World Destruction that Lydon did with Afrika Bambattaa?, that was after Flowers of Romance, are you basically hating on everything PiL did after Flowers of Romance?. I think there's some individual tracks on Album that aren't too bad but nothing nearly as startling as anything on Metal Box.

Never heard much of Jah Wobble's solo stuff to be honest, i was always just into PiL, any recommendations?[/quote']

Oh come now. You cannot compare The Professionals with The Rich Kids. Did you not rate their first 7" Just Another Dream? Or what about 123? Sure, their album I Didn't See It Coming was terrible.

Heard anything by the short lived project with Jimmy Pursey?

What about Cook and Jones' work with other artists/bands - with Joan Jett, Johnny Thunders, The Banshees, and Gen X?

Lydon's material post Flowers Of Romance? Yeah, I despise it. It saw his music taking a more commercial and far less interesting route.

Can't remember the title of Wobble's first album right now, but yeah, I'd recommend it.