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Person Of The Year Award 2011


Chris
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Keith Lemon.

Funniest thing on TV. And somehow avoids making column inches despite the programme containing infinitely more objectionable content for 'Outraged of Tunbridge Wells' to get in a lather over than anything else.

And despite normally not being a big fan, David Cameron for standing up to the Germany-France coalition party.

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Keith Lemon.

Funniest thing on TV. And somehow avoids making column inches despite the programme containing infinitely more objectionable content for 'Outraged of Tunbridge Wells' to get in a lather over than anything else.

And despite normally not being a big fan, David Cameron for standing up to the Germany-France coalition party.

hmm, there's standing up to them and then there's just sticking your fingers in your ears and going "lalalalalalalala" and chucking your toys out of the pram, just to play upto your pseudo hardman mates who are egging you on from the other side of the channel. politics is about diplomacy and compromise, not polarisation and isolation.

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Guest Gladstone

Na - David Cameron was in a lose-lose situation. I think he made the best of a bad hand. Ed Miliband's posturing after that nonsense is why he gets my vote in the other thread. I'd have loved to have seen what Miliband (or Clegg) would have done in that situation.

/Off topic

I'm struggling to think of anyone that's been particularly ace. I'll go for that kid who got his jaw smashed in by the thugs in the London riots - he took that whole incident so well and with a smile on his face on the press conference after he'd had his jaw rewired or whatever it was they did.

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hmm, there's standing up to them and then there's just sticking your fingers in your ears and going "lalalalalalalala" and chucking your toys out of the pram, just to play upto your pseudo hardman mates who are egging you on from the other side of the channel. politics is about diplomacy and compromise, not polarisation and isolation.

I don't think that's what Cameron did at all, that seems a wee bit of a dedicated anti-Tory spiel.

Your beloved Salmond the Hutt is destined to sell Scotland out to Europe for his own gain in rank and priviledge if we ever become independent, of that I am sure....

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I don't think that's what Cameron did at all, that seems a wee bit of a dedicated anti-Tory spiel.

Your beloved Salmond the Hutt is destined to sell Scotland out to Europe for his own gain in rank and priviledge if we ever become independent, of that I am sure....

that's exactly what cameron did, he was pandering to the eurosceptic backbenchers in his own party and desperate to say he was standing up for britain against big bad europe. the things he didn't want to happen are still going to happen only now he has no say in it. the other 26 eu members are creating a treaty which will still have a financial transactions tax which city of london firms will have to pay (because they all operate in europe, in euros). all he's managed to achieve is a soundbite while weakening the uk's position in europe and potentially the world.

not sure why you're bringing up salmond, it's got nothing to do with cameron's stance on the renegotiated treaty.

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that's exactly what cameron did, he was pandering to the eurosceptic backbenchers in his own party and desperate to say he was standing up for britain against big bad europe. the things he didn't want to happen are still going to happen only now he has no say in it. the other 26 eu members are creating a treaty which will still have a financial transactions tax which city of london firms will have to pay (because they all operate in europe, in euros). all he's managed to achieve is a soundbite while weakening the uk's position in europe and potentially the world.

not sure why you're bringing up salmond, it's got nothing to do with cameron's stance on the renegotiated treaty.

As I understand it, Cameron hasn't actually lost the UK anything at this stage, the EU can't just implement the changes that the Treaty was to intended to agree without UK approval as a member state. Unless the EU circumnavigates the rules which I suppose is always possible. You also assume that the Euro will continue to exist and that's not a foregone conclusion at this point in time.

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As I understand it, Cameron hasn't actually lost the UK anything at this stage, the EU can't just implement the changes that the Treaty was to intended to agree without UK approval as a member state. Unless the EU circumnavigates the rules which I suppose is always possible. You also assume that the Euro will continue to exist and that's not a foregone conclusion at this point in time.

they're just going to have a seperate treaty, so the 26 other countries will sign up to this treaty which regulate the eurozone and create tighter links between the 26 economies and budgets. as the uk holds more banks and financial service companies than any other eu country this will still affect us even though we're not in the euro. most of our exports are to europe and a large amount of our imports too. like it or not we are tied to the european economies and need to have a say in what happens there, a failed euro will not benefit the uk.

so while the lisbon treaty is off limits now, we may now just be left holding it while everyone else moves onto a new treaty and union. hopefully it'll all pan out happily but it's a pretty worrying situation. I do agree that it was a very hard position for cameron to be in and I don't know if anyone would have come out with a different outcome. what annoys me is that cameron and the tories are saying this is some kind of victory, when nothing has been solved and we have no idea how it will really affect us.

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it's the job of opposition to challenge and hold the government to account. i would expect them to challenge cameron no matter the result.

it's not about caving in, it's about diplomacy and negotiation. the way the whole thing was handled led to polarisation and posturing. as i admitted, it was a tough position to be in and i don't know if there was a better solution but the way it's being presented and the way it seems to have been handled is wrong.

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It's one thing to challenge the government's choices and hold them to account, but it's quite another for Miliband to claim that Cameron "failed Britain" at the EU Summit, when his own aides were briefing Labour MPs that he wouldn't have signed it either.

He's a two-faced, opportunistic fud.

EDIT: Public support is strongly in favour of the stance Cameron took.

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