punks unite?

[betamax]

Cries for social justice not relevant? You believe compassion and concern of no value? Also' date=' it is a fact that many thousands of people (like myself) have become active politically as a result of their involvement in the punk community.

Derivative and predictable sounds? Then I guess you never caught The Ex, Submission Hold, Recusant, or Guts Pie Earshot?

Rules? It is a fact that leftist/anti-authoritarian politics have always been an important facet of punk. Without such "rules" punk would be entirely meaningless.[/quote']

Erm, since when has a punk BADGE given anyone exclusivity regarding giving a fuck about how fucked up the world is????

Answer: NEVER

Ive protested so much about shit the FBI have a file on me (honestly)

But I dont class myself a punk

Better to be Unclassified

My Politics are essentially extreme left but again I woule rather have a mind of my own and not need a LABEL like punk to back up my beleifs....nor a political party....but thats another debate

I dont see the automatic connection between punk and politics and Id rather not follow anybodies RULES or join anyones pre defined social demographic, even if they are well intended....its just a principle

But these RULES of punk you mention indeed do make it meaningless to me at least and confirms my personal veiw that I could never buy into that kind of requirement....although I dont oppose it....its there ...I dont beleive its valid.....but so what.

Havent heard the band syou said, but Ill check em out, not to disagree, but cos they are probably quite good.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Erm' date=' since when has a punk BADGE given anyone exclusivity regarding giving a fuck about how fucked up the world is????

Answer: NEVER

Ive protested so much about shit the FBI have a file on me (honestly)

But I dont class myself a punk

Better to be Unclassified

My Politics are essentially extreme left but again I woule rather have a mind of my own and not need a LABEL like punk to back up my beleifs....nor a political party....but thats another debate

I dont see the automatic connection between punk and politics and Id rather not follow anybodies RULES or join anyones pre defined social demographic, even if they are well intended....its just a principle

But these RULES of punk you mention indeed do make it meaningless to me at least and confirms my personal veiw that I could never buy into that kind of requirement....although I dont oppose it....its there ...I dont beleive its valid.....but so what.

Havent heard the band syou said, but Ill check em out, not to disagree, but cos they are probably quite good.[/quote']

I'm sorry, but I said nothing about that if you care about issues of political concern, then you must first be a punk.

Sure, I am active in the punk community. But I have no need for any such label regarding my political activism. Except anarchist.

As I said, leftist/anti-authoritarian politics are central to punk. The punk community has always had a deep connection with politics.

[Marsh]

I was referring to the musical side of things, guys.

In other words, I like the music I like and don't care what it's classed as.

Politics, racism etc is a completley different matter. I don't wish to discuss that here - I thought we were talking about new / old punk.

I was saying (albeit in a roundabout way) that it shouldn't matter if a band are classed as "new" or "old" punk - If you like it, you like it, and that's all that should matter.

[betamax]

I agree

Politics has bugger all to do with music...it might be written into the lyrical content sometimes, but politics is in lots of genres of music, folk, blues, country even metal sometimes....

and Punk old or new has no ownership or rights to any political veiws nor should its fans align themselves to the left or the right

punk was about individualism surely...thinking for yourself

if old and new punk were to UNITE then the minds of people today would need to start operating outwith the control of the media.....now that would be immpossible yes?

theres no point talking about rules or organised groups of people with identical ideologies being anything to do with the origins of punk.....think, sulphate, heroin, boredom and bad cover bands jumping on a bandwagon and you'd be at least be being slightly realistic about it

but like I said ....all of that individualism is lost in 2004 so it really is a void subject as old OR new punk dont actually count for much in terms of social influence anymore ......other than simply being easily catagorised fast loud pop music

Im not trying to disrepect anyone on here who abides by punk regulations....thats fine and we would probably get on really well and share similar record collections*, but im just commenting on why I dont think punk COULD or SHOULD be UNITED

*my personal musical style of punk music would be any NY stuff from 74 to 77, The Dictators, The Tubes, Dead Boys, MC5, NY Dolls and some US No Wave after that....plus a few UK classics like The Adverts + Magazine etc AND A SHITLOAD OF INDIE PUNK FROM 78 AND 79 (Mekons, Prefects, Cravats etc). Also some 80s stuff like early Killing Joke and Discharge are quitenice too....and as far as Im bothered, whatever the political stance of any band Im listening to is, I will make my own mind up about how bad the government are etc, and just listen to the music

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I agree

Politics has bugger all to do with music...it might be written into the lyrical content sometimes' date=' but politics is in lots of genres of music, folk, blues, country even metal sometimes....

and Punk old or new has no ownership or rights to any political veiws nor should its fans align themselves to the left or the right

punk was about individualism surely...thinking for yourself

if old and new punk were to UNITE then the minds of people today would need to start operating outwith the control of the media.....now that would be immpossible yes?

theres no point talking about rules or organised groups of people with identical ideologies being anything to do with the origins of punk.....think, sulphate, heroin, boredom and bad cover bands jumping on a bandwagon and you'd be at least be being slightly realistic about it

but like I said ....all of that individualism is lost in 2004 so it really is a void subject as old OR new punk dont actually count for much in terms of social influence anymore ......other than simply being easily catagorised fast loud pop music

Im not trying to disrepect anyone on here who abides by punk regulations....thats fine and we would probably get on really well and share similar record collections*, but im just commenting on why I dont think punk COULD or SHOULD be UNITED

*my personal musical style of punk music would be any NY stuff from 74 to 77, The Dictators, The Tubes, Dead Boys, MC5, NY Dolls and some US No Wave after that....plus a few UK classics like The Adverts + Magazine etc AND A SHITLOAD OF INDIE PUNK FROM 78 AND 79 (Mekons, Prefects, Cravats etc). Also some 80s stuff like early Killing Joke and Discharge are quitenice too....and as far as Im bothered, whatever the political stance of any band Im listening to is, I will make my own mind up about how bad the government are etc, and just listen to the music[/quote']

Punk is political. Leftist/anti-authoritarian opinion is central to its cause, and it is this that seperates it from other music forms, seeking to build an alternative (via a network of zines, distros, bands, artists, and show spaces) to the music biz. These beliefs are not expressed only occasionally, but are what make punk what it is.

You talk of individualism - then should those who promote intolerance (be that racial or otherwise) be permitted a part in our scene? Should we say nothing? Should those who seek to manipulate, and so profit from our efforts, not be challenged?

And I'm sorry, but politics were of extreme importance to the origins of punk. And hey, remember RAR?

Social influence? As I've already shown, thousands of people across the globe have taken to political struggle (and still do in great number) via their contact with punk.

Anyway, I think i'm repeating myself somewhat.

[Guest highroller]

Punk is political. Leftist/anti-authoritarian opinion is central to its cause' date=' and it is this that seperates it from other music forms, seeking to build an alternative (via a network of zines, distros, bands, artists, and show spaces) to the music biz. These beliefs are not expressed only occasionally, but are what make punk what it is.

Social influence? As I've already shown, thousands of people across the globe have taken to political struggle (and still do so) via their contact with punk.

Anyway, I think i'm repeating myself somewhat.[/quote']

to be honest...re "real" punk you know your shit an i would never argue with you on that score...mainly because i dont give a rats ass about "real" or old school punk.

But you do sometimes talk shit. I just dont understand this "punk" ethos that we are diy or we are underground and we will stay that way..than these band go "hey everyone come to our show, visit our website, heres a flyer, buy our t shirt etc etc." What a load of fucking crap...why are you trying to attract people if you dont want to be known and heard.

Oh and who was that crust punk promoter that used to do good news to the sick gigs (which were fucking piss) ? Youre telling me he didnt want lots of people there so he could PAY the bands that he booked....there you go...ohhh shit, i just mentioned money in the diy scene...oh no...kinda blows your whole views open huh?

[Aaron Gilman]

does image play a part in the intolerance?

i would say i look fairly average(in the way i dress and my face), however my band get stick for being "pop" etc. although my ideas are fairly anti-greed and what not (although coming form middle class)

however

i know of people in bands who are resonably respected amongst Diy community, that wear black jeans and leather etc(stereotypical image if you will) but whose parents are X-pats ( british people working in another country and their pay package includes everything form private education for their children, to chauffer(sp) driven cars, and que skipping in most ques.) in lamens terms their parents are raping people of other countries, and keeping them deep in poverty,

however i'm the bad guy, because my band is deemed as pop.

[flossie suvara]

Feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm fairly sure that one of the beliefs (for want of a better word) that originated in the first punk era was that anyone , regardless of musical talent, could form a band and make music (I seem to remember seeing a cover of sniffing glue fanzine which showed three guitar chords, then at the bottom said "now form a band") - a backlash (as mentioned previosly) to the musical excesses of Yes, Genesis, etc.

So taking that argument to it's logical conclusion - 70's punk is responsible for Girls Aloud, Will Young, Gareth Gates and Kym Marsh...

No wonder old and new school "punks" don't get on....

[Guest allsystemsfail]

to be honest...re "real" punk you know your shit an i would never argue with you on that score...mainly because i dont give a rats ass about "real" or old school punk.

But you do sometimes talk shit. I just dont understand this "punk" ethos that we are diy or we are underground and we will stay that way..than these band go "hey everyone come to our show' date=' visit our website, heres a flyer, buy our t shirt etc etc." What a load of fucking crap...why are you trying to attract people if you dont want to be known and heard.

Oh and who was that crust punk promoter that used to do good news to the sick gigs (which were fucking piss) ? Youre telling me he didnt want lots of people there so he could PAY the bands that he booked....there you go...ohhh shit, i just mentioned money in the diy scene...oh no...kinda blows your whole views open huh?[/quote']

Those active in the DIY punk underground have no interest in going unheard. Hey, they're trying to get a message out - to push forward change. So, the promotion of their work and ideas involves no contradiction. The punk underground is, as I've aready said, an alternative to the music biz. It is proof that another way is possible - a music community built by the kids, for the kids.

Oh, and why so abusive?

[Guest Jake Wifebeater]

Oh and who was that crust punk promoter that used to do good news to the sick gigs (which were fucking piss) ? Youre telling me he didnt want lots of people there so he could PAY the bands that he booked....there you go...ohhh shit' date=' i just mentioned money in the diy scene...oh no...kinda blows your whole views open huh?[/quote']

That was Jeeves, who is now Filthpact's drummer. Oh, they were fucking piss, were they? That's a fucking daft thing to say. Why not say why you didn't like them? They were some of the best gigs I've ever been to, always a good atmosphere (OK, it MIGHT have had something to do with the cider). I was also lucky enough to pick up some great records at these gigs.

Another thing, money is not something you can avoid. The issue here is of money-grabbing and self-enrichment, which has no place in the punk/HC underground. So no, it doesn't blow the view wide open at all.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

does image play a part in the intolerance?

i would say i look fairly average(in the way i dress and my face)' date=' however my band get stick for being "pop" etc. although my ideas are fairly anti-greed and what not (although coming form middle class)

however

i know of people in bands who are resonably respected amongst Diy community, that wear black jeans and leather etc(stereotypical image if you will) but whose parents are X-pats ( british people working in another country and their pay package includes everything form private education for their children, to chauffer(sp) driven cars, and que skipping in most ques.) in lamens terms their parents are raping people of other countries, and keeping them deep in poverty,

however i'm the bad guy, because my band is deemed as pop.[/quote']

Hey man, I like your band. I've said so already. I wouldn't have asked you to play a show I was co-arranging had I not.

Regarding those DIY folks who you spoke of - we cannot choose who raises us. Many do not hold with the views or actions of their parents.

[Afro Droid]

Oh and who was that crust punk promoter that used to do good news to the sick gigs (which were fucking piss) ? Youre telling me he didnt want lots of people there so he could PAY the bands that he booked....there you go...ohhh shit' date=' i just mentioned money in the diy scene...oh no...kinda blows your whole views open huh?[/quote']

Jeeves is one cool motherfucker, and the GNTTS nights were certainly not 'piss'. I'm sure they're up there with some of the most successful nights Drakes has had. The In Decades Decline/We Become Less show at the old Drakes was an amazing night, ditto a coupl'a others. And it's not like he only put on crust bands either - Pagg played a couple of them, once with a girl-fronted total pop band. God bless Jeeves.

[Lawy Lawson:Attorney]

Punk was a reaction to the rock excess of outfits such as Yes' date=' ELP, Led Zeppelin, and other rock dinosaurs. Britain's then political climate was also crucial to its early beginnings - race riots, spiraling unemployment...

Regarding the use of rules - should we then tolerate racism, the promotion of christian belief - those who preach intolerance? Should we permit those who seek only to exploit our scene for financial gain - those with no interest in community, in what our scene means and stands for?[/quote']

Yeah, but we don't have to listen to them asshats whom preach hate.

When watching a documentary on American neo-nazis, a lot of them loved hardcore style music often with racist lyrics. You could argue that these skinheads are fighting against authority (The zionist conspiracy, political correctness) and trying to address what they see as the cause of society's problems. I certainly don't agree with what they're saying and I'm not even asking you to tolerate it, but in a twisted way, what they're doing is pretty punk (politicaly driven lyrics, "punk" music, indie distrubution, self-promotion - they sure aen't getting signed by major labels in the "jewish run media"). I don't see how punk is magically exclusive to the left when it's so easily subverted by right wing crackpots. Where did the darker side of the Oi movement come from, for example?

These guys? http://www.forwardarea.8k.com/

This disgusting lot? http://www.panzerfaust.com/h8machine/

What about this persons experiences: http://www.hipmama.com/node/view/1979

Alternatively ignore the band links. Those stupid fuckers don't deserve our time. Those, of course, are (thankfully) rare examples and I agree that a left-wing wing ethic is integral to most older punk while the mainstream newer stuff that's making the charts is often safely apolitical, I guess for the reason that, like another poster said, punk is pretty middle-class these days. I like the fact I can empathise politically with the Dead Kennedys and that the Pistols did seem to shake things up a bit, I'm just trying to make the point I don't think punk is exclusively left wing. It's just dangerously close to being an exclusive boys' club. It's like one of my favorite DK lyrics says:

"I'm cleansed of the system"

('cept when my amp needs electric power)

Or- "The Party line says No.

Feminists can't where fishnets"

You wanna help stop war?

Well, we reject your application

You crack too many jokes

and you eat meat

From: Where do you draw the line?

Perhaps that scares young punks. Maybe they don't want to be laughed at just because there mum bought them their first guitar and they didn't steal it from a pawn shop. Maybe what they have to say is valid too.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Jeeves is one cool motherfucker' date=' and the GNTTS nights were certainly not 'piss'. I'm sure they're up there with some of the most successful nights Drakes has had. The In Decades Decline/We Become Less show at the old Drakes was an amazing night, ditto a coupl'a others. And it's not like he only put on crust bands either - Pagg played a couple of them, once with a girl-fronted total pop band. God bless Jeeves.[/quote']

I couldn't agree more. He's put on a lotta great great shows. It was due to Jeeves that the band with which I was once involved got all our Aberdeen shows. One in Edinburgh too.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

Yeah' date=' but we don't have to listen to them asshats whom preach hate.

When watching a documentary on American neo-nazis, a lot of them loved hardcore style music often with racist lyrics. You could argue that these skinheads are fighting against authority (The zionist conspiracy, political correctness) and trying to address what they see as the cause of society's problems. I certainly don't agree with what they're saying and I'm not even asking you to tolerate it, but in a twisted way, what they're doing is pretty punk (politicaly driven lyrics, "punk" music, indie distrubution, self-promotion - they sure aen't getting signed by major labels in the "jewish run media"). I don't see how punk is magically exclusive to the left when it's so easily subverted by right wing crackpots. Where did the darker side of the Oi movement come from, for example?

These guys? [url']http://www.forwardarea.8k.com/

This disgusting lot? http://www.panzerfaust.com/h8machine/

What about this persons experiences: http://www.hipmama.com/node/view/1979

Alternatively ignore the band lyrics. Those stupid fuckers don't deserve our time. Those, of course, are (thankfully) rare examples and I agree that a left-wing wing ethic is integral to most older punk while the mainstream newer stuff that's making the charts is often safely apolitical, I guess for the reason that, like another poster said, punk is pretty middle-class these days. I like the fact I can empathise politically with the Dead Kennedys and that the Pistols did seem to shake things up a bit, I'm just trying to make the point I don't think punk is exclusively left wing. It's just dangerously close to being an exclusive boys' club. It's like one of my favorite DK lyrics says:

"I'm cleansed of the system"

('cept when my amp needs electric power)

Or- "The Party line says No.

Feminists can't where fishnets"

You wanna help stop war?

Well, we reject your application

You crack too many jokes

and you eat meat

From: Where do you draw the line?

Perhaps that scares young punks. Maybe they don't want to be laughed at just because there mum bought them their first guitar and they didn't steal it from a pawn shop. Maybe what they have to say is valid too.

The actions of nazi boneheads pretty punk? These racist filth have no place in our community - whose politics promote hate - whose message may inspire beatings or even murder.

Regarding these individuals/bands who have attempted to subvert what we have built - many many have stood in their way. The Angelic Upstarts (in the face of physical threats and actual assault) are just one example. Oi Polloi another.

The darker face of Oi? Sure, there are far right Oi outfits whose ideas I find objectionable - Section 5 and Condemned 84 are two. But these are few.

[Lawy Lawson:Attorney]

The actions of nazi boneheads pretty punk? These racist filth have no place in our community - whose politics promote hate - whose message may inspire beatings or even murder.

Well, they share the whole system of fanzines, split EPs and underground shows that punk does among other things. My point was that punk's political content is hard to control and, as those knobheads prove, can be twisted for hate, sadly.

[betamax]

Punk is political. Leftist/anti-authoritarian opinion is central to its cause' date=' and it is this that seperates it from other music forms, seeking to build an alternative (via a network of zines, distros, bands, artists, and show spaces) to the music biz. These beliefs are not expressed only occasionally, but are what make punk what it is.

You talk of individualism - then should those who promote intolerance (be that racial or otherwise) be permitted a part in our scene? Should we say nothing? Should those who seek to manipulate, and so profit from our efforts, not be challenged?

And I'm sorry, but politics were of extreme importance to the origins of punk. And hey, remember RAR?

Social influence? As I've already shown, thousands of people across the globe have taken to political struggle (and still do in great number) via their contact with punk.

Anyway, I think i'm repeating myself somewhat.[/quote']

I disagree with all of that

If punk is strictly aligned to politics with a strict agenda and a set of rules and etiquette to follow it smacks of hypocracy.....you are trying to fight a system by creating another system !!!

I also sense a DIY Punk Underground Ivory Tower mentality....

People have minds of their own and dont need to be force fed a message by people who have hijacked any form of music....be it punk or whatever

even if my politics were fundamentally similar to yours (as they may well be) I just dont beleive in mixing politics and music so drastically in the way the DIY underground punk scene does....its pointless, cliched and old hat (even though I agre that It sounds great sometimes)>>>>>>>>>>>>BUT even if a chorus of ''fuck the system, fuck the pigs'' sounds fantastic .....no one outside the DIY punk scene is listening anymore and hasnt for the last 25 years.....a point conveniently overlooked

[Guest highroller]

its MY OPINION that they were piss, he was also bandying about OPINIONS about Quik without actually seeing us as well...Its no slight on him personally, I dont even know him. I just didnt like the GNTTS nights.

Allsystemsfail...other than say that i thought you talked shit sometimes, I really dont think I was abusive. If it came accross that way, I sincerely apologise. I did actually open the post by giving some respect you should note.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I disagree with all of that

If punk is strictly aligned to politics with a strict agenda and a set of rules and etiquette to follow it smacks of hypocracy.....you are trying to fight a system by creating another system !!!

I also sense a DIY Punk Underground Ivory Tower mentality....

People have minds of their own and dont need to be force fed a message by people who have hijacked any form of music....be it punk or whatever

even if my politics were fundamentally similar to yours (as they may well be) I just dont beleive in mixing politics and music so drastically in the way the DIY underground punk scene does....its pointless' date=' cliched and old hat (even though I agre that It sounds great sometimes)>>>>>>>>>>>>BUT even if a chorus of ''fuck the system, fuck the pigs'' sounds fantastic .....no one outside the DIY punk scene is listening anymore and hasnt for the last 25 years.....a point conveniently overlooked[/quote']

To compare the actions and ideas of the DIY punk community with that of the state is simply ridiculous.

Force feeding? People can accept or reject the message as they wish.

No one is listening? I'm sorry, but you're wrong. The DIY punk underground has reached out in to the community, involved in many many political projects.

[Guest allsystemsfail]

its MY OPINION that they were piss' date=' he was also bandying about OPINIONS about Quik without actually seeing us as well...Its no slight on him personally, I dont even know him. I just didnt like the GNTTS nights.

Allsystemsfail...other than say that i thought you talked shit sometimes, I really dont think I was abusive. If it came accross that way, I sincerely apologise. I did actually open the post by giving some respect you should note.[/quote']

Regarding Jeeves' opinions on Quik - you forget that he asked you guys to play a two day punk fest at Drakes in the summer of 2002.

[Guest Vis]

The actions of nazi boneheads pretty punk? These racist filth have no place in our community - whose politics promote hate - whose message may inspire beatings or even murder.

Yeah' date=' but we don't have to listen to them asshats whom preach hate.

When watching a documentary on American neo-nazis, a lot of them loved hardcore style music often with racist lyrics. You could argue that these skinheads are fighting against authority (The zionist conspiracy, political correctness) and trying to address what they see as the cause of society's problems. I certainly don't agree with what they're saying and I'm not even asking you to tolerate it, but in a twisted way, what they're doing is pretty punk (politicaly driven lyrics, "punk" music, indie distrubution, self-promotion - they sure aen't getting signed by major labels in the "jewish run media"). I don't see how punk is magically exclusive to the left when it's so easily subverted by right wing crackpots. Where did the darker side of the Oi movement come from, for example?[/quote']

I think the point Craig was trying to get at was that like it or not, punk and its ethics will not and cannot fit in any given bracket. As he said, look at the neo-nazi bands. They may have majorly extreme views, but they are views all the same. You may not agree with them, but at exactly the same time they may not agree with you. Just because, fundamentally, they do not share your exact sentiments in life does not mean they cannot be part of a punk community. I am not agreeing with anything they have to say, but it is ignorant to disregard them because they are, dare I say it, 'different'.

[betamax]

To compare the actions and ideas of the DIY punk community with that of the state is simply ridiculous.

Force feeding? People can accept or reject the message as they wish.

No one is listening? I'm sorry' date=' but you're wrong. The DIY punk underground has reached out in to the community, involved in many many political projects.[/quote']

ok ill agree to disagree

i totally empathise with the anti establishment cause and dig lotsa punk music but will always see organised non compliance and waving the same old banners that have changed nothing as just another form of useless compliance that is NO more likely to change the world than a cheesy euro pop summer hit

strangely enough, like a few others have said....I always respect the people who try to fight back with whatever their weapon of choice so erm anyway

[Guest allsystemsfail]

I think the point Craig was trying to get at was that like it or not' date=' punk and its ethics will not and cannot fit in any given bracket. As he said, look at the neo-nazi bands. They may have majorly extreme views, but they are views all the same. You may not agree with them, but at exactly the same time they may not agree with you. Just because, fundamentally, they do not share your exact sentiments in life does not mean they cannot be part of a punk community. I am not agreeing with anything they have to say, but it is ignorant to disregard them because they are, dare I say it, 'different'.[/quote']

Fascists should not be permitted any foothold in our community. They should not be permitted (under any circumstances) a platform from which to preach racial intolerance - a hatred of those those who they believe inferior. Such views are an anathema to those like myself, who are active in the punk community. They conflict with punk's central tenet - a thirst for freedom - a seeking of social justice and equality. Their politics have, as I've said, inspired beatings and murder. What should we tell their victims? Hey, they're just different?

[Guest allsystemsfail]

ok ill agree to disagree

i totally empathise with the anti establishment cause and dig lotsa punk music but will always see organised non compliance and waving the same old banners that have changed nothing as just another form of useless compliance that is NO more likely to change the world than a cheesy euro pop summer hit

Aaaaaaargh!!! *runs off screaming*

[Jason]

If punk has to do with politics then surely Fat Mike from NOFX deserves atleast SOME punk credibility...? He was spent alot of his own money and time in creating political awareness for the young voters of America by starting up punkvoter.com and by teaching them through his band. There have been more than a few occations where NOFX have given the money they have been payed for a show BACK to the audience beacuse they felt their fans were being ripped off. Some may say that bands like NOFX are just mainstream sellouts (or what not) but they actually work very hard to get where they are and use their fame in a positive way.

I am very interested in this particular subject and would love to learn alot more about it but i cannot understand why people want to keep punk underground and very similar to an exclusive club? Surely if Punk is about ideas and politics (fighting against corporations etc) then you would want other people to know about them?