The Hip Hop Thread

[Soda Jerk]

Deck is among my favourites. He's a better storyteller and lyricist than some of Wu's big hitters. I'd peg him behind Ghost and Rae, ahead of Method and GZA. He has some strong solo output, but everything Wu do on their own will be compared to Cuban Linx, and fall short. I think a lot of Wu records have gone under the radar, especially in the last few years.

Cappadonna is underrated too. The Pillage is a solid record.

I can do without Masta Killa and ODB.

Edited November 19, 2016 by Soda van Jerk

[Jaaakkkeee]

On 11/17/2016 at 10:27 AM, Murrr said:

Anyone listen to any great raps this year? Here are some of my TOP PICKS:-

 

Really great year for the genre, IMO. The new De La Soul and A Tribe Called Quest records are surprisingly wonderful too.

Really enjoyed the new De La Soul album too. As for other great raps of this year, this is my top rap of the year. Out does the Kanye West version in every way.

 

[Murrr]

On 19/11/2016 at 10:32 AM, Soda van Jerk said:

Deck is among my favourites. He's a better storyteller and lyricist than some of Wu's big hitters. I'd peg him behind Ghost and Rae, ahead of Method and GZA. He has some strong solo output, but everything Wu do on their own will be compared to Cuban Linx, and fall short. I think a lot of Wu records have gone under the radar, especially in the last few years.

Cappadonna is underrated too. The Pillage is a solid record.

I can do without Masta Killa and ODB.

Ghostface regularly trades places with Nas at the top of the oh-so-prestigious "Murrr's favourite rappers" list. I think he's one of the all-time greats: his manic delivery is iconic, his patterns are crazy, and his lyrics are completely off-the-wall batshit. 

Rae next, then probably Meth, who's not a better rapper than GZA or Deck, but his charisma is absolutely nuts. Deck's "Triumph" verse alone probably slots him in at number four for me, then GZA, and Masta Killa/Cappadonna are relatively interchangeable after that.

I understand why people don't like ODB, but I love the guy. A pretty stinking rapper, but his persona's wildly entertaining. I need to be in a specific mood to listen to that nonsense though.

U-God always struck me as a "jobs for the boys" kinda guy. He's quite awful, and the other guys probably recognise that, but maybe they don't have the heart to tell their mate he stinks. RZA, for me, is one of the best producers of all-time, but an absolute atrocious rapper who wrecks almost everything he spits on.

Cool.

[Soda Jerk]

5 hours ago, Murrr said:

Ghostface regularly trades places with Nas at the top of the oh-so-prestigious "Murrr's favourite rappers" list. I think he's one of the all-time greats: his manic delivery is iconic, his patterns are crazy, and his lyrics are completely off-the-wall batshit. 

Rae next, then probably Meth, who's not a better rapper than GZA or Deck, but his charisma is absolutely nuts. Deck's "Triumph" verse alone probably slots him in at number four for me, then GZA, and Masta Killa/Cappadonna are relatively interchangeable after that.

I understand why people don't like ODB, but I love the guy. A pretty stinking rapper, but his persona's wildly entertaining. I need to be in a specific mood to listen to that nonsense though.

U-God always struck me as a "jobs for the boys" kinda guy. He's quite awful, and the other guys probably recognise that, but maybe they don't have the heart to tell their mate he stinks. RZA, for me, is one of the best producers of all-time, but an absolute atrocious rapper who wrecks almost everything he spits on.

Cool.

Good summary.

I can't listen to an ODB solo record. They're pretty awful IMO, but as a featuring artist or chiming in on a Wu record, he is pretty good. He's kind of like Flava Flav. There's absolutely no reason to listen to him on his own.

Method Man is a tough one for me. I love his voice and his delivery, but lyrically he is not the best. I don't think he's put out a properly good solo record either, but he's always a highlight on Wu record.

[Jaaakkkeee]

I Picked up a Death Grips album earlier this week that I hadn't heard of before. It might be new. That was good. Seems like they're getting heavier. 

[Soda Jerk]

Bottomless Pit? That came out this year. I need to listen to it actually. I read the guy from Tera Melos plays guitar on it.

 

Is any Odd Future stuff worth listening to? I've always ignored them, but I heard a Tyler the Creator song, I can't remember which, and it was pretty good. Deep voice rappers are the best. He sounds a bit like Chali 2na.

[Murrr]

I can't stand Tyler at all. To me, the guy just reeks of trying way too hard to be SHOCKING and CONTROVERSIAL. IMO, a crude, vulgar lyricist who masks a lack of genuine wit and lyrical intelligence with overbearing tastelessness. The hip-hop Donny Tourettes (or whatever that Towers of London dude's name was).

I'm not the biggest Odd Future fan, honestly. Earl Sweatshirt's last few projects were incredibly well-received and absolutely worth a look if you're into deep-voiced rappers, but I find him a little too morose and depressing for my tastes. He's a skilled rapper, though.

The MellowHype, Domo Gensis, and Hodgy Beats projects that I heard were completely uninteresting to me. I guess Frank Ocean is probably the collective's most successful member now, but he's an R&B artist. This year's "Blonde" was an excellent album though.

Vince Staples was affiliated with Odd Future at one point, though he was never an official "member." He's one of the most exciting young rappers in the world at the moment, IMO. Last year's "Summertime '06" was one of my favourite projects, and well worth a look for anyone seeking some bleak, rueful gangsta rap from a charismatic MC with an elastic voice.

[Soda Jerk]

Yeah, I'd heard Tyler was quite polarising, and his lyrics questionable. I listened to a bit today. Some of his solo tracks are pretty good when he's not going OTT, as I dig his voice and flow. but it's hard to look past the rape references and gratuitous use of the word faggot. Shame.

I gave an Odd Future mixtape a spin too. Vol.2 I think it was. Man, there is some godawful MCs in that group. Tyler and Earl definitely stand out. I'll need to listen to an Earl record.

Gave another OF project a go too. 'The Internet'. No idea which of them is on it, as I just had it on at work. I guess it's more R&B, with only sporadic raps. Really chilled slow jams. The beats are really sparse and cool.

[Murrr]

Been meaning to check The Internet out actually. I'm into that smooth, spacey vibe.

[ca_gere]

Quite like the Internet.

I've been shit at keeping up with Hip Hop this year. Utter shit. Don't think i've listened to anything on this page.

I've been listening to Sway in the morning a bunch and think a LOT of folks on there are great from the snippets of freestyling and whatnot, then I listen to a couple tracks and it's gash. I know it's only because I haven't dug deep enough that i'm saying it, but it's been a crap year for Hip Hop. I mean... Lil Yachty.

Will be going through what's on this page.

A major factor in my slipping on new hip hop was the fact I spent the best part of the year creating a playlist for my wedding. It was intense. I'm picky and obsessive with that kind of stuff. I focussed on rediscovering bangers from yesteryear so my horizons weren't expanding.

[Murrr]

The first half of the year was pretty gash, but things really turned around in the second. I've been really into the following releases:-

• Schoolboy Q - "Blank Face LP": Huge step up from his last record. Really dark and filthy sounding.
• Lushlife - "Ritualize": Lots of borderline-psychedelic indie rock sounds paired with a robust, authoritative MC. 
• Azizi Gibson - "A New Life": A basic and often crude lyricist, but his delivery is incredible and the slow trap beats at tailor-made to my current tastes.
• De La Soul - "... and the Anonymous Nobody": They came back from a long absence with one of the most creative and diverse records of their career.
• A Tribe Called Quest - "We got it from here...": Picked-up exactly where they left off. Chilled, playful music that comes with a message but never gets preachy. If you're as big a Tribe fan as me, listening to Phife's last few verses is kinda tough.
• Kemba - "Negus": Formerly YC the Cynic. If you liked his old stuff, you'll like this. Social consciousness turned-up to 10 with a stronger hook game than before.
• Ka - "Honour Killed The Samurai": I love this. So slow it's almost spoken word. Deep, booming delivery. Sparse, skin-crawling beats. Stripped back, bare, and raw.
• Isaiah Rashad - "The Sun's Tirade": Overlong, but one of the best TDE releases. Super chill & laid-back, but laced with inner turmoil.
• YG - "Still Brazy": Hated his first album, loved this. Fun, dumb, bouncy West Coast music. He took a timeless sound and made it his own.
• Danny Brown - "Atrocity Exhibition": If you can stomach Danny's wilder impulses, you'll love it. Dead End Hip-Hop called this hip-hop equivalent of a really crazy jazz album, and I love that description.
• Czarface - "atitleMurrrcan'tremember": Banging, old-school East coast shit. Head-nod music.
• Mick Jenkins - "The Healing Component": I feel there's an awesome new wave of smart, conscious rappers who can spit like crazy, but also craft these warm, catchy songs. Mick Jenkins is at the front of that pack and this album is surprisingly melodic.
• Saba - "Bucket List Project": Uplifting positivity from Chance's Chicago stable. Better than Chance, IMO. Title track is a banger.
• Flatbush Zombies - "3001: A Laced Odyssey": They turned the craziness down a notch and produced a trippy, spaced-out ride. Awesome production.
• Denzel Curry - "Imperial": Banging southern trap. Needs to develop stronger control of his cadence and inflections, but his flow is bananas.
• Skepta - "Konnichiwa": I don't even listen to grime, but this is legitimately one of the best UK hip-hop albums I've ever heard. Beats are incredible, and Skepta's on-point.
• Night Lovell - "Red Teenage Melody": Thick, murky trap with an MC whose voice is so deep it'll send rumbles through yer floorboards.

The Kendrick project was cool, but I'm a little fatigued with him after investing so much time into To Pimp A Butterfly (which I adored). Chance's album was fun, but he lost a lot of his character and spent most tracks impersonating his guests. I liked the Kanye album, but it felt like a shabby mixtape at times. Aesop Rock & Open Mike Eagle also released good projects if you like the backpack shit. Gucci Mane's "Everybody Looking" is fun as hell if you buy into his goofy persona. People loved the Royce da 5'9" and Elzhi records too: not really my bag anymore, but with your time if you like the fast-flowing rappity-rap stuff.

Shit lads, I still have a lot of quality stuff from Jay IDK, Swet Shop Boys, Death Grips, $uicideboy$, and a bunch of others to get lost in. I think I have a problem.

Fuck, I accidentally wrote a gigantic post again. Sorry lads.

[ca_gere]

Out of that list i've only listened to Faltbush Zombies and Skepta, and a bit of Tribe.

Feasting on that list today.

[Soda Jerk]

I'm going to gorge on that list on the next couple of days too.

Tip top compiling Murrr, because I have no clue where to go to pick up hip hop recommendations on a regular basis. 

[Lee Anderson]

me too. thanks for the tips

[Murrr]

You're welcome, gents. I threw those little mini-reviews down so you can decide which to check out, and which might not be to your tastes.

[ca_gere]

Working my way through still. Kemba a standout for me so far. Already is a great track. Love the activist vibes to the album too.

[Murrr]

20 hours ago, ca_gere said:

Working my way through still. Kemba a standout for me so far. Already is a great track. Love the activist vibes to the album too.

Oh absolutely. I feel like he took similar themes to those expressed on To Pimp A Butterfly, but stripped much of that album's denseness away and wrapped everything up in a bunch of catchy songs. Common's new record is probably worth exploring if you're into that subject matter: I wasn't particularly fond of it, but other people loved it.

[Jaaakkkeee]

On 11/27/2016 at 3:15 PM, Soda van Jerk said:

Bottomless Pit? That came out this year. I need to listen to it actually. I read the guy from Tera Melos plays guitar on it.

 

Is any Odd Future stuff worth listening to? I've always ignored them, but I heard a Tyler the Creator song, I can't remember which, and it was pretty good. Deep voice rappers are the best. He sounds a bit like Chali 2na.

That's the one. No dicks on this album cover so the name didn't stick in my mind.

As seen by this thread already, OF are quite polarising. I'm a big Tyler fan. I think his earlier stuff is a little too much shock for the sake of shock. He lists Eminem as an influence and you can really tell. I personally think he's pretty hilarious at times. His newer stuff is a lot better. Check out Cherry Bomb. His first three solo albums (Bastard, Goblin and Wolf) are about alter-egos, split personalities and rapping from different character POVs, so as you can see, very Slim Shady-esque. But I think it's more ambitious than Em. Bastard, Goblin and Wolf form a grand story, with Wolf being a prequel and set at Camp Flog Gnaw (which is Tyler's IRL yearly festival).  Also, get ready to hear golf wang and every iteration you can think of. OF is OFWGKTA (Odd Future Wolf Gang Kill Them All). Tyler turned the Wolf Gang part in to Golf Wang, which is his clothing line, then flip reversed it to make his Camp Flog Gnaw.

I rate earl too. V. happy that EarlWolf is a thing again. Domo is pretty decent but not on Tyler or Wolf levels. Frank Ocean was also a part of OF for a while, and he's just the bee's knees.

Heres some of my favourite Tyler tracks, and note how there's none off Bastard.

[Soda Jerk]

Out of the stuff I hadn't already heard; Lushlife, Kemba, and Skepta were the highlights of that list for me.

Also didn't know Aesop Rock had a new record. I like it a lot.

 

I dig the Royce and Elzhi records too. I definitely lean more towards the boom-bap fast flowing stuff than the sparse, spacey trap stuff, more often than not.

 

2 hours ago, Jaaakkkeee said:

That's the one. No dicks on this album cover so the name didn't stick in my mind.

As seen by this thread already, OF are quite polarising. I'm a big Tyler fan. I think his earlier stuff is a little too much shock for the sake of shock. He lists Eminem as an influence and you can really tell. I personally think he's pretty hilarious at times. His newer stuff is a lot better. Check out Cherry Bomb. His first three solo albums (Bastard, Goblin and Wolf) are about alter-egos, split personalities and rapping from different character POVs, so as you can see, very Slim Shady-esque. But I think it's more ambitious than Em. Bastard, Goblin and Wolf form a grand story, with Wolf being a prequel and set at Camp Flog Gnaw (which is Tyler's IRL yearly festival).  Also, get ready to hear golf wang and every iteration you can think of. OF is OFWGKTA (Odd Future Wolf Gang Kill Them All). Tyler turned the Wolf Gang part in to Golf Wang, which is his clothing line, then flip reversed it to make his Camp Flog Gnaw.

I rate earl too. V. happy that EarlWolf is a thing again. Domo is pretty decent but not on Tyler or Wolf levels. Frank Ocean was also a part of OF for a while, and he's just the bee's knees.

Heres some of my favourite Tyler tracks, and note how there's none off Bastard.

 

  Reveal hidden contents

 

 

 

I hadn't picked up on it before you mentioned it, but the Eminem vibe on 'Yonkers' especially is pretty huge.

[Jaaakkkeee]

22 hours ago, Soda van Jerk said:

 

I hadn't picked up on it before you mentioned it, but the Eminem vibe on 'Yonkers' especially is pretty huge.

Yeah you can really tell with his early stuff. And as "shocking" or "horrorcore" as his stuff can be at times, videos like Tamale show he isn't just doing it for the sake of shock, he's trying to make a point.

You'll probably notice a big difference between Goblin/Wolf tracks i posted and the stuff off Cherry Bomb. On OF Vol 2 there's a song he does called Sam Is Dead. This is Sam, the antagonist of the Wolf album. In the video Tyler shoots and kills 3 version of him self These are thought to be his alter-egos, or at least him putting the trilogy to rest

His newest album Cherry Bomb doesn't have any alter-egos. But it does feature him taking a girl to a triple feature at a movie theatre. The name of the feature is bleeped out on the album, but in the video to Fucking Young he's in a cinema watching himself. So many have theorised that the triple feature is Bastard/Goblin/Wolf. So although he killed off his alter-egos and went on to make a straight up Tyler album, it still revolves around him taking a girl to a movie theatre to watch his own trilogy. 

I think that's one of the many reasons people look past his use of homophobic language and love his music. The guy is on another level. Kanye mumps and moans about not being able to get in to fashion, Tyler did it. Eminem has a "rough" sort of concept album in Slim Shady/MMLP/MMLP2, but Tyler didn't just connect songs here or there, he made a trilogy of albums that form a cohesive story. He didn't just make a alter-ego like Slim Shady to hide behind when controversy came knocking - all Tyler's videos are directed by "Wolf Haley" - his white alter-ego. He hosts a yearly carnival/festival, he's made a show (Loiter Squad) on Adult Swim, he got to direct Mountain Dew adverts for the superbowl, and he's worked with his biggest idols (Pharrell, Kanye, Charlie Wilson). Oh, and he's only 25. 

 

Sure, his discography is full of stinkers. I own a couple of his albums on vinyl and there's entire sides I don't regularly listen to. But he's aiming high, and more often than not, when he tries to do something, he achieves it.  

[Murrr]

Comparing Kanye and Tyler's respective voyages into fashion is a little more nuanced than that, IMO. Tyler created a bright streetwear range, which, realistically, anyone on this forum could do with a little startup money. Kanye sought entry into the high fashion market, and because he's a grown baby, kicked and screamed until he got his way. This ultimately worked, and I'd go as far as saying that hip-hop has never had such a successful crossover in that particular industry (his "Yeezy Season" premieres are huge events, and the sneakers are absurdly popular). 

Not that I give a single shit about fashion, but I'm a Kanye stan. Tyler does seem like a really cool dude though, and Yonkers is 90% incredible. I have complete and utter respect for him for building the Odd Future/Golf Wang brand from the ground up, and I think he deserves everything that comes his way. I just don't like his tunes.

This is the best thing he's ever done tho:-

 

[Murrr]

On 03/12/2016 at 3:33 PM, Soda van Jerk said:

I dig the Royce and Elzhi records too. I definitely lean more towards the boom-bap fast flowing stuff than the sparse, spacey trap stuff, more often than not.

Well shit, here's a few more for you then:-

• Epidemic - "4 Dimensions on a Paper": Should've been on my big list, TBH. Jazzier.
• Nolan the Ninja - "He(art)": Shoutier.
• Villain Park - "Same Ol' Shit EP": Funner.
• Beneficence - "Basement Chemistry": Dustier.

If you like Beneficence and Epidemic, get on their respective back catalogues. Some really good stuff in there.

Have you heard of Clear Soul Forces before? They're my "go to" group for this kind of rap. Just four guys rapping their asses of over straightforward production. Pretty great.

[Soda Jerk]

I've not heard Clear Soul Forces before, or anyone else on that list. I'll go through all of them tomorrow and see what sticks.

What would you recommend as an essential staple of the newer Trap stuff? Not just from this year, but overall. I've not heard much so far, but what I do hear doesn't resonate with me as much as the more up-tempo, fun, full-flow stuff like Czarface, and the like. It seems that the traditional sample-heavy/MCs filling every bit of space in a bar stuff is lessening, which is totally my thing. Trap production is usually really interesting, and almost feels like a grand, operatic prog-rock epic, which I dig, but I find a lot of the vocalists/MCs to be a little too sparse, and less flow-orientated. A lot of it seems a little closer to spoken word even, which usually fails to hold my attention. Is there anything out there that could change my mind?

[Murrr]

13 minutes ago, Soda van Jerk said:

I've not heard Clear Soul Forces before, or anyone else on that list. I'll go through all of them tomorrow and see what sticks.

What would you recommend as an essential staple of the newer Trap stuff? Not just from this year, but overall. I've not heard much so far, but what I do hear doesn't resonate with me as much as the more up-tempo, fun, full-flow stuff like Czarface, and the like. It seems that the traditional sample-heavy/MCs filling every bit of space in a bar stuff is lessening, which is totally my thing. Trap production is usually really interesting, and almost feels like a grand, operatic prog-rock epic, which I dig, but I find a lot of the vocalists/MCs to be a little too sparse, and less flow-orientated. A lot of it seems a little closer to spoken word even, which usually fails to hold my attention. Is there anything out there that could change my mind?

I used to really look down my nose at trap. For a while, I was dead set on the idea that hip-hop had to be based-on top-level lyricism and dusty, sample-based beats. Trap's sloppier lyricism, lazier flows, and often ignorant themes just didn't click with me at all, and I became an elitist in a genre largely free of elitism.

It's hard to pinpoint when my perspective changed exactly, but I think it started with the beats. Some of the instrumentals that these producers come-out with just sounds incredible to me. I like dark, foreboding basslines, cloudy atmospheres, and booming 808s. Once I developed an addiction for that, the MCs started making a lot more sense to me. I became more forgiving of the rappers' technical deficiencies and started focusing on their voices as part of the instrumentation, if that makes sense. I think that when you're listening to fast, rappity-rap, the joy comes from paying close attention to their flows, rhyming patterns, and intricate wordplay. Do that with your average track record and the rapper's gonna sound like an amateur.

The point I'm trying to make is that I almost had to re-train the way I was digesting these records. It's the same as when I was just getting into hip-hop, and I had to re-condition myself not to listen for melodies and hooks, but rhythm.

Anyway, I think Freddie Gibbs is a good transitional artist, specifically his latest album: "Shadow of a Doubt." He's an incredibly versatile MC who sounds incredible over a wide variety of production, but that album isn't strictly trap. There are a bunch of more traditional sounding beats on there too, and Freddie's just a great, ballsy rapper. This makes him the perfect guy for any trap newcomer, IMO. If you like songs like "Rearview" on that album, move to some of his other projects: "Cold Day In Hell," "Baby Face Killa," and "ESGN" are much trappier.

The Underachievers' "Evermore - The Art of Duality" is great too. Lyrically, they're very focused on some really mind-bending stuff, but it's all positive in the end. The first half of this record is quite light, and the second turns it up with some rattling bass and snappy snares. One of the MCs is a typical New York gruff/street-sounding guy too.

T.I. and Young Jeezy are usually credited with building the genre, but I think that Three 6 Mafia's influence is much more noticeable in the modern sound. Their debut album, "Mystic Stylez," is crude at times, but dark and raw as hell. An essential listen for understanding the full breadth of modern hip-hop, IMO.

[colb]

RTJ3 is pretty good....