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fatboy

tunnels and drummonds gigs

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came back from the deadloss gig at cafe drummonds feeling very dissapointed,

not due the fact the acts weren't up to scratch but due to the shit sound and hardly any people there. i have no idea how they make money seriously

they hardly advertise gigs with posters, ends up the bands watching each other

no one organizes stage times prior to the night with the bands to iron out any issues

and it seems to be "who wants to play?" and anyone who puts their name forward gets to play

all they are worried about is getting bands in without any work expecting them to pull punters in by word of mouth

and also, no fault for the sound guy who did the gig tonight but this new guy getting trained up is inexperienced and can't handle the sound without supervision

the boy sound checks hi-hats for fuck sake!!!!!

being left to his own devices while the boy who does the sound is proping the bar up getting paid for it

they were simple things that could have been fixed if the guy knew what he was doing but he clearly didnt plus the other guy made no attempt to help out when things went wrong

the poor little boy was getting all stressed taking it upon his shoulders with the bands getting pissed off with the sound and not being able to communicate to him, nae his fault but he clearly isnt capable of running soung himself

had to go up to the back of the bar to listen to deadloss as the sound was so trebally and loud it was painfull to hear

first 2 songs brians mic was up loud enough to hear him over his actuall voice

ryans guitar was really loud eating up the bass and craigs guitar, shite, simple things that could be fixed

also 5 on the door?

ok i paid it, going to a good cause, the mongol rally. but fits the deal when dodgers come in and the young boy who is taking money is too scared to mak them pay when they come in wi their patter "im only having one drink" so he lets them in for nowt

im sorry but if i have to pay for a gig them cunts should pay too regarldess of how dodgy they look or how much hassle they will give you for nae wanting to pay

matanuska the moniters were louder than the pa speakers for most of in untill the moniters started intermitantly working

couldnae tell u last time i seen hen at a gig,

only reason there was posters and publicity about this event was cause brian kens fit he is doing and made, and he did the same as he would for fudge nights anywhere else.

i have been thinking about this shit for a while and have been wanting to speak to people about it, but I hope i don't get too many peoples backs up about this as i don't have any person problems with any memebers of staff and im not blaming any individuals but as whole i think the way drummonds/tunnels is run is a farce

end rant

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Both tunnels and drummonds seem to be a shadow of their former selves recently. A few years ago i was at a gig most nights of the week, and usually in tunnels or drummonds, but i can count the number of times ive been THIS YEAR on one hand. I would still be going to gigs constantly if their was the selection their used to be!

I cant really say much about the onstage sound quality, but the last gig i went to in drummonds the sound was horrific.

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erm for a night like last night its up to the promoter to get folk down, and as it was fudge I imagine posters were up in the usual places etc (i remember seeing them up, it think).I would agree turnouts on the whole are down a fair bit but people just dont have as much cash as they did and gigs are a an expece people just cant afford.

Why does hen need to be at the gig?

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Why does hen need to be at the gig?

isnt he the promoter for the tunnels and drummonds, bar last night which was run by the fudge team

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Warden pretty much nails it, in far less words.

'Da kids' don't have the same amount of pocket money to be going to gigs 4-5 times a week like they might have done a while back, add in the social networking/download culture where most of them can just listen to bands on Cryspace to their hearts content rather than wait 10 minutes for an MP3 download from the AUBL site on a shitey 56k dial up connection as it was before. People being more selective explains the massive gap between your 'big' gigs with larger crowds packing in, and your bread and butter FOUR HEAVY BANDS FOR 3 QUID DOON THE TUNNELS every other night with no advertising and no paying punters.

There ends my questionable go at a sociology lecture.

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Tunnels - needs to be given a makeover gearwise. Monitors have bee playing up in the past and with the same engineer behind the desk I have noticed a decline in the past few years. Could be the engineer but I highly doubt it. The local gig overkill should be stripped down! It is the same 3 bands every gig atleast 3 times a month. Yawnorama!

Drummonds - I don't know as I only go to enjoy an overpriced after the pub during the week every so often.

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Hey,

I just think if The Moorings format was followed, it would be a bit more successful. The Moorings organise bands months in advance and produce quality posters that look really cool and are plastered eveywhere.

Drummonds is in an ideal location for bands, so it could clearly capitalise on this location and make more money. Its disappointing, if it is true, to hear that people can walk in free. Thats piss poor management and can be sorted.

Tunnels is in a really shit location therefore NEEDS TO BE advertised otherwise noone will know apart from the bands and ppl who visit aberdeen music will turn up.

Easy for me to say, i dont have to organise this, but I do practise with my band all the time so it is miles better knowing who your playing with and having an idea if it will be busy. Pretty much 75% time i know a drummonds or tunnels gig will be dead, but its really good fun playing live and great practise and i enjoy seeing other bands so its cool i guess.

Also Drummonds and Tunnels need a maintenance guy for the drums just to keep on top of tuning, heads, the actual gear, simple things like, cymbal sleeves to protect (expensive) cymbals, and then to recommend if new equipment is needed. I dont know who does the moorings, but that kit seems to be in a stable condition everytime so its obviously looked after to a degree - good work. maybe employ this person?!

Anyway, thats my rant.

Doug

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Guest idol_wild
Hey,

I just think if The Moorings format was followed, it would be a bit more successful. The Moorings organise bands months in advance and produce quality posters that look really cool and are plastered eveywhere.

Drummonds is in an ideal location for bands, so it could clearly capitalise on this location and make more money. Its disappointing, if it is true, to hear that people can walk in free. Thats piss poor management and can be sorted.

Tunnels is in a really shit location therefore NEEDS TO BE advertised otherwise noone will know apart from the bands and ppl who visit aberdeen music will turn up.

Easy for me to say, i dont have to organise this, but I do practise with my band all the time so it is miles better knowing who your playing with and having an idea if it will be busy. Pretty much 75% time i know a drummonds or tunnels gig will be dead, but its really good fun playing live and great practise and i enjoy seeing other bands so its cool i guess.

Also Drummonds and Tunnels need a maintenance guy for the drums just to keep on top of tuning, heads, the actual gear, simple things like, cymbal sleeves to protect (expensive) cymbals, and then to recommend if new equipment is needed. I dont know who does the moorings, but that kit seems to be in a stable condition everytime so its obviously looked after to a degree - good work. maybe employ this person?!

Anyway, thats my rant.

Doug

I think it's important to recognise that The Moorings doesn't have bands on every night, therefore the gear is used considerably less, and thus it is easier to maintain.

I've never been a fan of Drummonds as a gig venue, and I doubt I ever will be. But The Tunnels could be great. Really great. A few years back, it was looking as if it would dominate Aberdeen's live music scene for years to come, but it's laissez faire attitude has seen it almost collapse. The space is good, the size is good, and the sound is often good, but they really do need to restructure their live programming in a big way, coupled with how they approach advertising (i.e. by actually doing some). It's been quite a number of years since I attended an inhouse booked show at The Tunnels - it was always external promoters' shows that appealed to me. Because more often than not, they gave a damn. Well the promoters I liked did, anyway.

It became clear to me before I departed Aberdeen a year ago that The Tunnels knew their money would be made via outside promoters putting on shows there, with little actual effort on their own part, yet they would sometimes make it difficult for said promoters to really maximise the place (i.e. placing curfew restrictions, removing the "backstage" area for artists to lounge/eat in, not allowing promoters to use their own sound engineers or, indeed, not providing the specific requested inhouse engineer, etc). To me, this was folly. That said, on the whole, I enjoyed a pretty good working relationship with The Tunnels as a promoter. I just really want to see that place reach the potential it has.

And as for Hen being at every concert at The Tunnels - nonsense! We have to remember that he is the live events programmer, therefore a lot of his work is done during the day - should he expected to give up his evenings to attend every show? No. He's also not really a promoter - he's a booker - and there's a big difference. The Tunnels need to hire a separate promotional team, which includes a poster designer and a "street team" of some description, to heavily poster all over Aberdeen (especially universities and colleges!), and distribute flyers for all levels of shows.

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Please listen to idol_wild

Before you go dissing the venue is it actually the venues fault or the person putting on the show. From my understanding if theirs a night free (ie nothing an externally promoted/clubnight etc.) at tunnels or drummonds they will ask a load of local bands to play so the venue doesnt go empty, these are usually at short notice so not alot can be done promotion wise and im sure bands will quickly twig that their might not be alot of people down, if no one knows about the gig, no one will be there (rocket science).

I think tunnels are realising less people are coming up to them with gigs so doing more off their own backs, see mudhoney, 80's matchbox, sky larkin etc.

Also people should really be thankful that these places have a backline at all, dont like the state its in, use your own gear (PA excluded obviously).

I agree with this:

The Tunnels need to hire a separate promotional team, which includes a poster designer and a "street team" of some description, to heavily poster all over Aberdeen (especially universities and colleges!), and distribute flyers for all levels of shows.

EDIT: One last thing, dont like the gigs your getting offered to play, DO IT YOURSELF!.

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5 quid for a gig is not expensive. You'd pay more than that for a dvd that costs 10 measly pence to manufacture. Apart from that, idol_wild and iomega are spot on.

Besides, don't like it, DIY. Enjoy staring at your shoes while giving each band a paltry ten pound note for their troubles, before taking the rubbish posters you couldn't find the time to stick up to the recycling centre.

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I always think drummonds could be done with a complete renovation. The removal of the horseshoe was a step in the right direction but it's still not a great venue in terms of shape. If you look at other venues dotted around the country, one thing I like is places split into bar/stage rooms. I.e you can enter the premises without paying for the gig, have a drink in the bar, then decide if you want to see the gig going on in the back room. How many people open the doors to drummonds, have a look at the price, weigh it up against the music coming from the back and just shut the door and walk away? Loads that's how many.

If I owned the place and had the money, I'd split the place in two. Maybe extend the 'balcony' and close off the top floor or even box in the stage by putting Walls between the pillars. I just think it'd generate more customers full stop, whether they're there for the music or not. Sometimes it's nice to get away from the stage and not have to leave a venue altogether. Anyway, what was this thread about? Sound was fine last night, great in fact. Can't comment on promotion.

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Guest idol_wild
came back from the deadloss gig at cafe drummonds feeling very dissapointed,

not due the fact the acts weren't up to scratch but due to the shit sound and hardly any people there. i have no idea how they make money seriously

they hardly advertise gigs with posters, ends up the bands watching each other

no one organizes stage times prior to the night with the bands to iron out any issues

and it seems to be "who wants to play?" and anyone who puts their name forward gets to play

all they are worried about is getting bands in without any work expecting them to pull punters in by word of mouth

and also, no fault for the sound guy who did the gig tonight but this new guy getting trained up is inexperienced and can't handle the sound without supervision

the boy sound checks hi-hats for fuck sake!!!!!

being left to his own devices while the boy who does the sound is proping the bar up getting paid for it

they were simple things that could have been fixed if the guy knew what he was doing but he clearly didnt plus the other guy made no attempt to help out when things went wrong

the poor little boy was getting all stressed taking it upon his shoulders with the bands getting pissed off with the sound and not being able to communicate to him, nae his fault but he clearly isnt capable of running soung himself

had to go up to the back of the bar to listen to deadloss as the sound was so trebally and loud it was painfull to hear

first 2 songs brians mic was up loud enough to hear him over his actuall voice

ryans guitar was really loud eating up the bass and craigs guitar, shite, simple things that could be fixed

also 5 on the door?

ok i paid it, going to a good cause, the mongol rally. but fits the deal when dodgers come in and the young boy who is taking money is too scared to mak them pay when they come in wi their patter "im only having one drink" so he lets them in for nowt

im sorry but if i have to pay for a gig them cunts should pay too regarldess of how dodgy they look or how much hassle they will give you for nae wanting to pay

matanuska the moniters were louder than the pa speakers for most of in untill the moniters started intermitantly working

couldnae tell u last time i seen hen at a gig,

only reason there was posters and publicity about this event was cause brian kens fit he is doing and made, and he did the same as he would for fudge nights anywhere else.

i have been thinking about this shit for a while and have been wanting to speak to people about it, but I hope i don't get too many peoples backs up about this as i don't have any person problems with any memebers of staff and im not blaming any individuals but as whole i think the way drummonds/tunnels is run is a farce

end rant

Hrm, having done a little digging on what this gig was all about, I think half of your rant is completely and utterly invalid and misdirected. The promoter was external, thus it was down to the promoter to capture a crowd and organise the night in terms of soundchecks and stage times and to generally enlighten people as to what the schedule is.

Your only issue is sound. Which I've never felt has been terrific in Drummonds anyway.

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Guest Gladstone
came back from the deadloss gig at cafe drummonds feeling very dissapointed,

not due the fact the acts weren't up to scratch but due to the shit sound and hardly any people there. i have no idea how they make money seriously

they hardly advertise gigs with posters, ends up the bands watching each other

no one organizes stage times prior to the night with the bands to iron out any issues

and it seems to be "who wants to play?" and anyone who puts their name forward gets to play

all they are worried about is getting bands in without any work expecting them to pull punters in by word of mouth

and also, no fault for the sound guy who did the gig tonight but this new guy getting trained up is inexperienced and can't handle the sound without supervision

the boy sound checks hi-hats for fuck sake!!!!!

being left to his own devices while the boy who does the sound is proping the bar up getting paid for it

they were simple things that could have been fixed if the guy knew what he was doing but he clearly didnt plus the other guy made no attempt to help out when things went wrong

the poor little boy was getting all stressed taking it upon his shoulders with the bands getting pissed off with the sound and not being able to communicate to him, nae his fault but he clearly isnt capable of running soung himself

had to go up to the back of the bar to listen to deadloss as the sound was so trebally and loud it was painfull to hear

first 2 songs brians mic was up loud enough to hear him over his actuall voice

ryans guitar was really loud eating up the bass and craigs guitar, shite, simple things that could be fixed

also 5 on the door?

ok i paid it, going to a good cause, the mongol rally. but fits the deal when dodgers come in and the young boy who is taking money is too scared to mak them pay when they come in wi their patter "im only having one drink" so he lets them in for nowt

im sorry but if i have to pay for a gig them cunts should pay too regarldess of how dodgy they look or how much hassle they will give you for nae wanting to pay

matanuska the moniters were louder than the pa speakers for most of in untill the moniters started intermitantly working

couldnae tell u last time i seen hen at a gig,

only reason there was posters and publicity about this event was cause brian kens fit he is doing and made, and he did the same as he would for fudge nights anywhere else.

i have been thinking about this shit for a while and have been wanting to speak to people about it, but I hope i don't get too many peoples backs up about this as i don't have any person problems with any memebers of staff and im not blaming any individuals but as whole i think the way drummonds/tunnels is run is a farce

end rant

Just to say that my clubnight on Friday night pisses all over this post.

3 very good bands played and all sounded very good.

Place was busy (just shy of 200 paying customers, plus the band members etc).

Organisation was good - it was a joint effort between me and Hen, but Hen had already told the sound guy before I got to Drummonds at about 5.30pm, so no issues there at all.

Callum was up getting the stage organised etc from 6pm onwards (soundcheck wasn't due to start until 7pm), and the first band started checking at bang on 7pm, with all bands there on time etc.

It makes such a difference if everyone plays their part, arrives on time, doesn't fuck about on stage and does what the sound engineer asks them to do.

I reckon bands that sound shite in Drummonds will mostly be to blame themselves, rather than the kit in-house or the engineer.

People should stop pissing and moaning about Drummonds and Tunnels. It will take you a long time to find another town/city in the country that has two venues that has full backline and decent sound system, with decent sound engineers and puts on live music nearly 7 nights a week, accommodating every new band in the city and giving them the much needed live practise they need.

Anywhere else we've played, we've had to take amps with us etc and make sure that one of the local bands has a drumkit we can share.

If you're not happy with Drummonds or Tunnels, don't go. If you're not happy with the full backline provided, bring your own. If you're not happy with the level of promotion or calibre of bands, book your own. Ultimately, if you're not happy with the venues, try buying and running your own venue, and see how easy you think it is.

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I always think drummonds could be done with a complete renovation. The removal of the horseshoe was a step in the right direction but it's still not a great venue in terms of shape. If you look at other venues dotted around the country, one thing I like is places split into bar/stage rooms. I.e you can enter the premises without paying for the gig, have a drink in the bar, then decide if you want to see the gig going on in the back room. How many people open the doors to drummonds, have a look at the price, weigh it up against the music coming from the back and just shut the door and walk away? Loads that's how many.

If I owned the place and had the money, I'd split the place in two. Maybe extend the 'balcony' and close off the top floor or even box in the stage by putting Walls between the pillars. I just think it'd generate more customers full stop, whether they're there for the music or not. Sometimes it's nice to get away from the stage and not have to leave a venue altogether. Anyway, what was this thread about? Sound was fine last night, great in fact. Can't comment on promotion.

I think that's a brilliant idea.

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II've never been a fan of Drummonds as a gig venue, and I doubt I ever will be. But The Tunnels could be great. Really great. A few years back, it was looking as if it would dominate Aberdeen's live music scene for years to come, but it's laissez faire attitude has seen it almost collapse. The space is good, the size is good, and the sound is often good, but they really do need to restructure their live programming in a big way, coupled with how they approach advertising (i.e. by actually doing some). It's been quite a number of years since I attended an inhouse booked show at The Tunnels - it was always external promoters' shows that appealed to me. Because more often than not, they gave a damn. Well the promoters I liked did, anyway.

Totally agree.

Tunnels was the place a while back and looked like it would turn into something special, however it has not turned out that way. Seeing the likes of Lightning Bolt at the venue were truly great nights.

However it looks like Aberdeen will continue to be the sort of place it has been for years: The same few bands playing the same few not so great venues until a new generation of the same bands play the same not so great venues.

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Every time I have played either venue it has been fine on terms of sound, but yes it can be off from time to time but that happens everywhere I guess. The problem with having little to no crowd is not new. If bands want more people to turn up stop playing tunnels/drummonds three times a month! Then use that time to practice hard and play every now and then and people might just want to come check you out, if its less regular. I wouldn't want to see a big touring/recording band that regular so why would, I want to come see small bands up to 3 times a month in Aberdeen. Less is more!

Also playing outside of town might help that problem.

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Ah but John, sometimes it is easier just to bitch and moan rather than be proactive...

Why does a paying customer have to be proactvive ?

People have given reasons as to why they do no longer venture out to many gigs in Aberdeen. If promoters/venue owners/bands feel that the reasons given are bitching and moaning then they need to get their heads out of the sand.

When it gets to the stage where people drive 60+ miles to see something different then you know something is wrong.

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