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Lisbon Treaty signed into law

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Ha Ha, even they can't squirm out of this, and they could be on course for a pre-election civil war. Probably not, but I can always hope.

I doubt it. I was just watching Newsnight with Hannan and some guy from The Spectator. The latter suggested that we will probably end up with an in-or-out referendum in 5 or 6 years time. Mr Hannan, however, was remarkably vague on exactly what kind of plebiscite we should be getting. I expect he's fearful of running on a UKIP ticket if he doesn't toe the line.:up:

And I agree with Spectator guy. It seems clear that you're either in or out, going forward.

mmmm, In'N'Out...

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Ha Ha, even they can't squirm out of this, and they could be on course for a pre-election civil war. Probably not, but I can always hope.

Bloody good chance of it at the moment, Cameron's going to attempt to get out of it today, but he's just handed Brown a massive advantage by completely changing his tune. I wonder what would happen now if Brown stepped up and promised a referendum, maybe even passing it into law before the election just to completely screw up the Tories?

Whether or not Broon has the backbone to pull off such a stunt is beyond me - but it would certainly liven up the election campaign!

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I'm confused by the Conservative's strategy here. The chance of a referendum on the treaty of Lisbon became zero as soon as Brown signed it, right? So, their 'iron-clad guarantee' of a referendum on Lisbon was just pure nonsense.

This is a massive own goal. I presume that they will now start backtracking and propose some non-binding referendum on repatriation of certain powers to Westminster... how the fuck did they end up on the back foot on this issue?

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Guest Tam o' Shantie

"Mr Cameron had angered sparking anger from the leaders of France and Germany by writing to Mr Klaus urging him to delay ratifying the treaty."

eh?!

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My, the future is an interesting place. One thing I'm relatively certain of though; if Britain leaves the EU, then I am definitely in favour of Scotland leaving Britain, or I'll emigrate to an EU country, as I'm sure we Europeans will be allowed in, don't penalise us just because of the mentalists! I choose Holland.

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My, the future is an interesting place. One thing I'm relatively certain of though; if Britain leaves the EU, then I am definitely in favour of Scotland leaving Britain, or I'll emigrate to an EU country, as I'm sure we Europeans will be allowed in, don't penalise us just because of the mentalists! I choose Holland.

I take the opposite view myself. I'll happily back 'independence' if there's no political will to preserve the sovereignty of the United Kingdom. I don't see the purpose of a union within a union, 3 tiers of government etc.

Less is more, especially when applied to politicians.

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I'm confused by the Conservative's strategy here. The chance of a referendum on the treaty of Lisbon became zero as soon as Brown signed it, right? So, their 'iron-clad guarantee' of a referendum on Lisbon was just pure nonsense.

They still had the ability to back out as long as it didn't pass into law - which, in theory, the UK can still pull out before December 1st. In all reality, the UK can pull out any time they like - the problem is that now, it becomes a question of EU membership or not, whereas before, it was simply a question of yay or nay to Lisbon. If Lisbon does pass into law, then it would seem that the EU are in a much stronger bargaining position with the UK - whereas before, the UK could easily have blackmailed the EU into giving them virtually everything they wanted due to the Nice limit of 27 countries.

This is a massive own goal. I presume that they will now start backtracking and propose some non-binding referendum on repatriation of certain powers to Westminster... how the fuck did they end up on the back foot on this issue?

Beats me, I wouldn't be surprised if it ended up costing them an outright victory in the next election. Middle England is undoubtably enraged by their about-turn and UKIP will benefit. I wouldn't be surprised to see massive gains from fringe parties at the next election now - it's clearly obvious that neither Labour nor the Conservatives are willing to hold a referendum on EU membership.

As for Poland - Kaczynski proved he has no bottle whatsoever by signing the treaty. If he had stuck to his guns and refused to sign as was his right to do so - then he might've just won some respect from a nation that pretty much hates him.

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For those who were intrigued by what this is heres a summary, quoted from wikipaedia.

What is it?

It is designed to change the workings of the European Union

How does it accomplish this?

Prominent changes included:

  1. More qualified majority voting in the Council of Ministers
  2. Increased involvement of the European Parliament in the legislative process through extended codecision with the Council of Ministers
  3. Eliminating the pillar system
  4. Creation of a President of the European Council with a term of two and a half years and a High Representative of the Union for Foreign Affairs and Security Policy to present a united position on EU policies.
  5. The Treaty of Lisbon will also make the Union's human rights charter, the Charter of Fundamental Rights, legally binding.

More information

Treaty of Lisbon - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

EUROPA - Treaty of Lisbon - Full text of the Treaty

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Read Simon Heffer's irate email to Daily Telegraph staff | Media | guardian.co.uk

The use of correct engrish is an ongoing issue at the Telegraph, apparently.

Read Simon Heffer's irate email to Daily Telegraph staff | Media | guardian.co.uk

What an amazing rant.

I have never liked his articles and he annoys me when he appears on TV.

I don't like a comma before an and

I also would never use a comma before the word but

:stupid:

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Read Simon Heffer's irate email to Daily Telegraph staff | Media | guardian.co.uk

The use of correct engrish is an ongoing issue at the Telegraph, apparently.

Read Simon Heffer's irate email to Daily Telegraph staff | Media | guardian.co.uk

What an amazing rant.

I have never liked his articles and he annoys me when he appears on TV.

I don't like a comma before an and

I also would never use a comma before the word but

:stupid:

Great piece. I can't believe how basic some of those errors are. He doesn't even come across as condescending, just passionate about his work. cheers for the link. :up:

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