Lemon Tree No More???

[Pierre Von Mondragon]

Aberdeen never survived the closure of The Venue, not culturally anyhow.

[stuartmaxwell]

Its only a couple of venues away from turning into Dundee.

you say that, but we have

two great small DIY venues in drouthies and the balcony

three mid size with good rigs holding 200-400 in westie, reading rooms and doghouse

larger venues like caird hall, marryat hall and *sigh* fat sams live

all of which have been trading for a good while

this is sufficient for the amount of gigs that happen here

[framheim]

That is just one example of the completely inaacurate reporting by the press and sly and underhand way in which the council have handled this.

Two very important points have been missed. The council's ONLY offer was a short term loan of 250k on the basis that each of the 10 board members personally put up a guarantee of 25k from their own pockets. The council simply did not make the reported second offer and the one that they did make was untennable

ok, so obviously there's more going on here than was first supposed. can anyone explain the exact figures and process that occurred in the run up to the decision to go into voluntary liquidation? how much money did the council cut and when? how did that affect the amount of profit the lemon tree was making? would it have made a difference?

obivously there's a lot of strong feelings about this and the majority of relatively negative comments are based on disappointment rather than anything else i'm sure.

[delboy]

like most things in life the lemon tree was taken for granted and it is natural such a reaction is going to spark when its taken away. i was as guilty as the next person for not going there much (due to work committments i hardly go out at all anyway these days).

its just a damn shame that the venue is gone, we could go into the ins and outs and whys all day but i feel aberdeen won't be the same without it.

[Andy Mulhern]

like most things in life the lemon tree was taken for granted and it is natural such a reaction is going to spark when its taken away. i was as guilty as the next person for not going there much (due to work committments i hardly go out at all anyway these days).

its just a damn shame that the venue is gone, we could go into the ins and outs and whys all day but i feel aberdeen won't be the same without it.

aye agreed. So embrace change, it won't be the same so make it a little different.

Its gone, goodbye, onwards.....

(ahem.... more Vocoustics dates announced very soon.... )

[lowball]

like most things in life the lemon tree was taken for granted and it is natural such a reaction is going to spark when its taken away. i was as guilty as the next person for not going there much (due to work committments i hardly go out at all anyway these days).

its just a damn shame that the venue is gone, we could go into the ins and outs and whys all day but i feel aberdeen won't be the same without it.

13days till its officially gone!!!!!!!!!!

[delboy]

true still might be saved as yet!!!

[nesta6245]

Taken from the Press & Journal story:-

Councillors agreed unanimously that the venue should be offered the chance to take out a loan from the city council administered Aberdeen Business Enterprise Scheme, or the Lemon Tree could have had its overdraft facility underwritten up to a new limit by the local authority.

Neither option was taken up by the board.

Full story can be found Here

This is what I can't understand. Call me a sceptic but I wonder if anyone on the board has other interests ie property developing.

Hi, btw, I'm new here. If it wasn't for the Lemon Tree closure, I place I love and will sorely miss, I wouldn't have found this place. It's quite good, depending on how friendly you all are I might stay.

[framheim]

This is what I can't understand. Call me a sceptic but I wonder if anyone on the board has other interests ie property developing.

Hi, btw, I'm new here. If it wasn't for the Lemon Tree closure, I place I love and will sorely miss, I wouldn't have found this place. It's quite good, depending on how friendly you all are I might stay.

welcome, as with most forums there are a few bad seeds but stick with it and you'll be fine. take most of what you read with a pinch of salt.

[nesta6245]

welcome, as with most forums there are a few bad seeds but stick with it and you'll be fine. take most of what you read with a pinch of salt.

Cheers

Now back to the Lemon Tree. In the paper it's saying the staff are trying to raise a large amount of cash and have 2 weeks to do so. No mention of where I send my money though and how I can help. Madness gig tonight, I would be willing to stand outside the exhibition centre with a bucket before the gig collecting, same for Kaisers on Saturday. This is where they will get the donations, most people going to AECC for a gig will want to help save the place, sure a fair number of them will be LT regulars. To get the biggest benefit there would need to be a lot of us collecting.

Does anyone know how to go about contacting them?

[Flash@TMB]

My thoughts:

It's a real shame that the Lemon Tree has closed.

It's location didn't help. If it was located on Belmont Street then it would probably still be here.

Those that claim there are are shortage of venues in this city need a reality check... if there genuinely was a shortage then the LT would have been packed every night and making money. That's basic economics. If anything there is clearly a shortage of gig go-ers otherwise venues wouldn't keep going bust (that's umm 3 in the past 3 years). We'd do much better to promote our local music scene as a whole.

Drakes was a bigger loss IMO, and if we are to have a venue that is provided with financial assistance then something along those lines would be enormously beneficial to the local musicians... and would be deserving of financial assistance.

Musa caters for some of the performing arts type stuff that you used to find in the Lemon Tree, has a more appropriate capacity, and is more centrally accessible.

[Ollie]

My thoughts:

It's a real shame that the Lemon Tree has closed.

It's location didn't help. If it was located on Belmont Street then it would probably still be here.

Those that claim there are are shortage of venues in this city need a reality check... if there genuinely was a shortage then the LT would have been packed every night and making money. That's basic economics. If anything there is clearly a shortage of gig go-ers otherwise venues wouldn't keep going bust (that's umm 3 in the past 3 years). We'd do much better to promote our local music scene as a whole.

Drakes was a bigger loss IMO, and if we are to have a venue that is provided with financial assistance then something along those lines would be enormously beneficial to the local musicians... and would be deserving of financial assistance.

Musa caters for some of the performing arts type stuff that you used to find in the Lemon Tree, has a more appropriate capacity, and is more centrally accessible.

wise comment. Drakes was a massive loss. There are a lot of talented musicians in this city. Drakes was a focal point for many years. Although I think that the Moorings is becoming central.

[stuartmaxwell]

sorry for the cynical viewpoint here but...

save the lemon tree? petitions and money buckets? these people are completely unreal and are thinking irrationally. its time wasted that could have been spent looking for another job.

this was a boardroom level decision as a result of a decision to remove of capital injections. A change was needed years ago, unfortunately the LT board didnt/were unable to take a firm grip on the ship and steer it in the right direction to make the operation financially viable in any way, shape or form. As im sure Flash can vouch, we are looking at fundamental economics here. This is executive level mismanagement and complacency, and things only lasted this long because the council were (rightfully) convinced that this was of cultural benefit to the city, unfortunately there was pressure on this operation since day one.

a petition with names and 1000 in coppers is not going to change anything

It is a shame for all of the staff and a sad loss of a good music venue to Aberdeen, the LT has contributed a lot to Aberdeen and has always been up there supporting people of all ages with their ventures, wether it be arts, theatre, music, comedy etc It is a sad loss and hopefully something new will arise out of the ashes. Remember what happened after drakes?

[Guest -becky-]

Cheers

Now back to the Lemon Tree. In the paper it's saying the staff are trying to raise a large amount of cash and have 2 weeks to do so. No mention of where I send my money though and how I can help. Madness gig tonight, I would be willing to stand outside the exhibition centre with a bucket before the gig collecting, same for Kaisers on Saturday. This is where they will get the donations, most people going to AECC for a gig will want to help save the place, sure a fair number of them will be LT regulars. To get the biggest benefit there would need to be a lot of us collecting.

Does anyone know how to go about contacting them?

WHeey this is more like it.. As you've probably read in the papers this morning we need 200,000 in order to put in an offer before liquidation in 2 weeks.

this is north scotland - news, entertainment, jobs, homes and cars

this is north scotland - news, entertainment, jobs, homes and cars

The campaign will include a ring round this afternoon to potential benefactors for emergency funding .. the likes of Stuart Milne, Tom Farmer Foundation, Shell and past sponsors and past acts etc c, and previous acts that have played. We've set up a bank account under the name Save The Lemon Tree Campaign, The website will hopefully be up by the end of the day so people can make donations and we've already got about 500 signatures on the petition. Thankfully the evening express were outside the lemon tree yesterday when this was going on so the press is good!

Thanks for your support and any help given to the committee is greatly appreciated.. if you want to volunteer you services or your band for a fundraiser.. any suggestions are greatly appreciated! email rebeccablack86@hotmail.com or make contact through the wbsite once it's up. (i'll put a link on here)

Becky

[Guest Jake Wifebeater]

It's no loss. I never set foot in the place as there were never any gigs that tempted me along. The few times I considered going I was put off by the extortionate prices so I'm glad to see it go down the shitter. Sure, it's a damn shame that people have lost jobs over it, but there's far, far too many venues putting on shitty gigs as it is and I've said for ages that Aberdeen is over-saturated by mediocrity and it's far too easy for any bunch of two-bit ding-peddlers to get a gig and kid themselves they're on the way.

Doesn't mean a great deal in the long run. After all the snivelling when Drake's went tits up, it hasn't exactly meant a drying-up of the number of bands starting up, has it? Kinda hoped it would.

[thegossip]

no cuts

how much money did the council cut and when?

the council did not cut any money.

they bailed it out in june with 60k, and they continued to pay the 190k annual grant.

its is impossible to keep throwing more and more public money at them.

Close it, and start again from scratch.

[Old Gold]

WHeey this is more like it.. As you've probably read in the papers this morning we need 200,000 in order to put in an offer before liquidation in 2 weeks.

this is north scotland - news, entertainment, jobs, homes and cars

this is north scotland - news, entertainment, jobs, homes and cars

The campaign will include a ring round this afternoon to potential benefactors for emergency funding .. the likes of Stuart Milne, Tom Farmer Foundation, Shell and past sponsors and past acts etc c, and previous acts that have played. We've set up a bank account under the name Save The Lemon Tree Campaign, The website will hopefully be up by the end of the day so people can make donations and we've already got about 500 signatures on the petition. Thankfully the evening express were outside the lemon tree yesterday when this was going on so the press is good!

Thanks for your support and any help given to the committee is greatly appreciated.. if you want to volunteer you services or your band for a fundraiser.. any suggestions are greatly appreciated! email rebeccablack86@hotmail.com or make contact through the wbsite once it's up. (i'll put a link on here)

Becky

What happens to the accumulated cash if the full 200 grand isn't achieved?

[Scootray]

Is there any plan on what to do with the 200,000 is you ever managed to reach that amount? Surely there needs to be some sort of structure as to what it will be used for and the long term future?

Simply pumping money into a company that's losing money left, right and centre isn't the way forward. I say let it go into liquidation. At least that way, someone with some ideas will maybe come forward and bring something to the table as a way of making it a profitable business.

[Guest -becky-]

It's worth trying to save even if it isn't under the same management/structure.. it could resurface as a combination as a commercially viable venue encompasing a separate council funded arts programme which would pay hire to the venue. Myabe it was poorly managed but it's worth saving what it was in essence, an arts organisation wich was a landmark in Aberdeen culture.

I have a job interview this afternoon maxi, if the lemon tree was saved in some capacity that doesn't mean i'd have a job there. i'm just not letting complacency set in yet when there's a chance to try to stage a worthwhile protest for Aberdeen.

[framheim]

how much money did the council cut and when?

the council did not cut any money.

they bailed it out in june with 60k, and they continued to pay the 190k annual grant.

its is impossible to keep throwing more and more public money at them.

Close it, and start again from scratch.

that's what i thought but then becky said "the bottom line is that yesterday the council cut all funding" which seems to go against that. hence my question to try and get some solid facts out.

[stuartmaxwell]

why would you plough 200,000 into a bleeding business? what happens the next time it needs money?

it is proper strategy that is needed, not money

[Scootray]

Exactly Maxi. A day after it closes the doors and already there is talk of pumping money into it? That just shows there has been no discussions in how to make the LT a viable business, but rather to keep it afloat just now and see what happens. I sure as hell wouldn't give any money to a business that has no long term strategy.

[framheim]

It's worth trying to save even if it isn't under the same management/structure.. it could resurface as a combination as a commercially viable venue encompasing a separate council funded arts programme which would pay hire to the venue. Myabe it was poorly managed but it's worth saving what it was in essence, an arts organisation wich was a landmark in Aberdeen culture.

I have a job interview this afternoon maxi, if the lemon tree was saved in some capacity that doesn't mean i'd have a job there. i'm just not letting complacency set in yet when there's a chance to try to stage a worthwhile protest for Aberdeen.

how you going to persuade businesses to invest money into a venture which has failed? what's going to happen differently should you raise the money? i know this sounds really negative but i just want to make sure you have an answer. call it devils advocate.

i'd love to see the lemon tree saved but not if it's just going to close again in a year.

[Hog]

The AECC has been getting its act together..the Lemon Tree hasn't.

[delboy]

trying to raise money to save the venue really isnt the answer i feel, all it would be doing is papering over the cracks. someone needs to take hold of the business and give it a complete overhaul. it needs to be someone who looks at the project long term and is prepared to lose money in the short term whilst sorting the place out.