Alkaline Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Haha, half of this thread is just hippy bullshit and propaganda.I agree with Stripey, it's not the guns that make the decisions, it's the individual people that use them.And shooting is most definately a sport. Ask the guys that do the cross-country ski/shoot at the winter olympics i'm sure they'd say that the effort involved in humphing a gun around and skiing and having the energy and concentration to line up a shot at the end of it makes it a sport. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Haha, half of this thread is just hippy bullshit and propaganda.I agree with Stripey, it's not the guns that make the decisions, it's the individual people that use them.And shooting is most definately a sport. Ask the guys that do the cross-country ski/shoot at the winter olympics i'm sure they'd say that the effort involved in humphing a gun around and skiing and having the energy and concentration to line up a shot at the end of it makes it a sport.I haven't disagreed with anything you have said here. I never said it wasn't a sport, i questioned why it was. I said from the start that its the individual that makes the decision, but i feel that, unfortunelty, some people aren't capable of making that decision correctly so to elminate any other problems, just get rid of the things. THEY ARE NOT GOOD!!!! THEY DO NOBODY ANY FAVOURS!! THEY RUIN PEOPLES LIVES AND KILL!!! THEY WERE MADE TO RUIN PEOPLES LIVES AND KILL, THEY HAVE NO OTHER USE!!! I am no hippy and have no interest in propaganda, i just know how much it hurts to have someone you are close to involved in a shooting and it is not a good thing. No sport is worth it! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore Mel Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 THEY ARE NOT GOOD!!!! THEY DO NOBODY ANY FAVOURS!! THEY RUIN PEOPLES LIVES AND KILL!!! THEY WERE MADE TO RUIN PEOPLES LIVES AND KILL, THEY HAVE NO OTHER USE!!! Actually I think you'll find they're quite useful for hunting. If someone's going to shoot someone else, they'll get a gun regardless of legality. During the post-Dunblane gun amnesty, you didn't see queues of Birmingham gangsters lining up to turn over their weapons. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I haven't disagreed with anything you have said here. I never said it wasn't a sport, i questioned why it was. I said from the start that its the individual that makes the decision, but i feel that, unfortunelty, some people aren't capable of making that decision correctly so to elminate any other problems, just get rid of the things. THEY ARE NOT GOOD!!!! THEY DO NOBODY ANY FAVOURS!! THEY RUIN PEOPLES LIVES AND KILL!!! THEY WERE MADE TO RUIN PEOPLES LIVES AND KILL, THEY HAVE NO OTHER USE!!! I am no hippy and have no interest in propaganda, i just know how much it hurts to have someone you are close to involved in a shooting and it is not a good thing. No sport is worth it! I didn't quote you as i wasn't disagreeing with most of what you were saying. So i wasn't having a pop at you in particular. I was clarifying why it was a sport.Grow up and think before you start mouthing off at people because you can't make out the difference between someone stating something and someone having a go at you personally. If i think you're a useless hippy cunt i'll call you one to your face. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Actually I think you'll find they're quite useful for hunting. If someone's going to shoot someone else, they'll get a gun regardless of legality. During the post-Dunblane gun amnesty, you didn't see queues of Birmingham gangsters lining up to turn over their weapons.I'll keep that in mind when I'm down the local forest looking for deer. Just because you can get them anyway doesn't mean that you should make it easier to do so, does it?Ciaranx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Gold Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 We all used to shoot non-living stuff with my mates air rifle back in the day. It's a fact that guns are fun.Still no urge to kill people though, which is nice. Hell, I probably couldn't bring myself to kill a rabbit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I didn't quote you as i wasn't disagreeing with most of what you were saying. So i wasn't having a pop at you in particular. I was clarifying why it was a sport.Grow up and think before you start mouthing off at people because you can't make out the difference between someone stating something and someone having a go at you personally. If i think you're a useless hippy cunt i'll call you one to your face.I didn't mouth off at you?! I agreed with you and reinforced my point, wasn't a dig mate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraemeC Posted February 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I cannot believe that people would argue that having guns is a good thing. Why legalise something that can do harm on someone else?Hmmm...cars, knives, fags, all the above kill hundreds of thousands of people worldwide.Who is arguing having guns is a good thing? Why not legalise drugs? Thats the easy way out...eliminating them is better and safer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraemeC Posted February 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 How are guns a sport? I've never understood that. You don't exactly need to be fit to do it. If shooting is classed as a sport then I'm the world champion of sitting on my ass doing fuck all and I'm thinking of entering next years eating and sleeping national play-offs. The Competition is pretty fierce though... Not having a go, understand what your saying, just something i never really understood, same with F1, is that a sport?You seem to be good at making negative comments on subjects you know fuck all about...The level of fitness required to compete in top class motor sport is incredible and the drivers are among the fitest athletes in the world...As for shooting as a sport...YouTube - Blake Miguez "Run and Gun" IPSC USPSAIts best to keep your trap shut when you have no clue what you are talking about..!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I didn't mouth off at you?! I agreed with you and reinforced my point, wasn't a dig mate.Maybe it was just that you quoted me and then launched into a full caps locked rant about being anti-guns that led me to believe that you were having a pop. Needless to say, if it wasn't meant like that i apologise for taking offence to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Hmmm...cars, knives, fags, all the above kill hundreds of thousands of people worldwide.Who is arguing having guns is a good thing?Thats the easy way out...eliminating them is better and safer.Greame, I also state in other posts about knives etc. , have a read man. I know there are other dangerous things out there, many more deaths are caused by cars/alcohol/drugs/knives/etc than guns, i appreciate that. Still doesn't defend having a tool specifically designed to kill, in the public domain. sport or no sport. I don't care who's defending it, I wasn't really talking specific about people on this site, just people in general. again, my posts aren't meant to offend, just explaining my point, which I'm not that great at anyway, let alone on a computer screen. Again, My initial posts were not directed at anyone in particular and meant to cause offense.Ciaranx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 You seem to be good at making negative comments on subjects you know fuck all about...The level of fitness required to compete in top class motor sport is incredible and the drivers are among the fitest athletes in the world...As for shooting as a sport...YouTube - Blake Miguez "Run and Gun" IPSC USPSAIts best to keep your trap shut when you have no clue what you are talking about..!!Man, I think you are reading too much into that, its tongue-in-cheek. The reason I said that was so that people WOULDN'T be offended at what I said because i know how easy its done on here, not the other way around. hence the smiley. I also admitted that i didn't know about the sport several times after I said that.Ciaranx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hardcore Mel Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I'll keep that in mind when I'm down the local forest looking for deer. Just because you can get them anyway doesn't mean that you should make it easier to do so, does it?CiaranxIt's likely that it would be harder to obtain a gun under license than on the black market actually. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Maybe it was just that you quoted me and then launched into a full caps locked rant about being anti-guns that led me to believe that you were having a pop. Needless to say, if it wasn't meant like that i apologise for taking offence to it.yeah, sorry man. Should have structured that a wee bit better. Ciaranx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GraemeC Posted February 23, 2007 Author Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 I also admitted that i didn't know about the sport several times after I said that.CiaranxHence..."Its best to keep your trap shut when you have no clue what you are talking about..!!" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairyScaryMark Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 A certain proportion of gun crime is going to happen irrespective of what government does.We could however decrease some of the gun crime that goes with organised crime by taking such as measures as prescribing herion, crack and cocain to addicts. If there is no market for drug dealing, it will cease to exist.It is hard to say exactly how much crime is going to be decreased by less access to guns. I suspect that oppertunist criminals, will be less likely to carry guns but master criminals will still find whatever tools they want to carry out their crimes.The reason replica firearms are so dangerous is becuase many can be converted into fatal weapons. In a news report, in the last couple of years, a BBC reporter purchased a replica firearm for 15 (i think it was) and got a firearms expect to convert it into a weapon, they tested the weapon and it could have easily killed somoene.The comparison with Switzerland serves some purpose but there are great cultural differences, the problem with gun crime in the UK, seems to be largely with people owning hand guns in cities. I suspect the situation is greatly differnet in Switzerland.A bit like as a judge said in relation to 24 hour drinking, "continental style drinking culture requires continential style people."--Mark-- Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 It's likely that it would be harder to obtain a gun under license than on the black market actually.Yeah, your probably right to be fair. I just generally don't see the point in them but they are here so nothing can be done. Ciaranx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tronaliser Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Hence..."Its best to keep your trap shut when you have no clue what you are talking about..!!"ok........ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Neutral Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jesus.H.Christ Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Guns don't kill people....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alkaline Posted February 23, 2007 Report Share Posted February 23, 2007 Guns don't kill people.......Rappers do? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cloud Posted February 24, 2007 Report Share Posted February 24, 2007 We could however decrease some of the gun crime that goes with organised crime by taking such as measures as prescribing herion, crack and cocain to addicts. If there is no market for drug dealing, it will cease to exist.Sorry, but that's not true. For a start, where would people get drugs from in order to become addicted? Let's say the government opens "hard drugs here" shops. Those shops would have to make a profit, and no doubt the government would tax it too - so you'd have a situation where the supplier on the street can supply it for far cheaper than the government owned shops can. That means people are tempted to smuggle it, meaning that the situation is back to square one, but with a legal outlet. We'd then see a situation where the French (and no doubt other countries) would enforce ridiculously tough controls against people travelling from the UK and Ireland due to the availability of drugs - exactly as HMRC does to people arriving from Amsterdam.It wouldn't hurt to prescribe hard drugs to people on an rehabilition course where they cannot distribute the drugs to others - but that needs to be met with a huge increase in spending.A question, though.What happens when the smackhead who's been buying legal heroin can't afford to get any? Are you seriously suggesting that the taxpayer should be paying for someone to get out of their face on drugs? That would be a vote winner, definitely... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Savant Posted February 24, 2007 Report Share Posted February 24, 2007 How are guns a sport? I've never understood that. You don't exactly need to be fit to do it. If shooting is classed as a sport then I'm the world champion of sitting on my ass doing fuck all and I'm thinking of entering next years eating and sleeping national play-offs. The Competition is pretty fierce though... Not having a go, understand what your saying, just something i never really understood, same with F1, is that a sport?From Dictionary.com:sport /spɔrt, spoʊrt/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[spawrt, spohrt] noun1. an athletic activity requiring skill or physical prowess and often of a competitive nature, as racing, baseball, tennis, golf, bowling, wrestling, boxing, hunting, fishing, etc.2. a particular form of this, esp. in the out of doors.3. diversion; recreation; pleasant pastime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Savant Posted February 24, 2007 Report Share Posted February 24, 2007 It wouldn't hurt to prescribe hard drugs to people on an rehabilition course where they cannot distribute the drugs to others - but that needs to be met with a huge increase in spending.Isn't that what HairyScaryMark just said...? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HairyScaryMark Posted February 24, 2007 Report Share Posted February 24, 2007 Sorry, but that's not true. For a start, where would people get drugs from in order to become addicted? Let's say the government opens "hard drugs here" shops. Those shops would have to make a profit, and no doubt the government would tax it too - so you'd have a situation where the supplier on the street can supply it for far cheaper than the government owned shops can. That means people are tempted to smuggle it, meaning that the situation is back to square one, but with a legal outlet. Herion is already prescribed to drug addicts in a number of European countries, such as Switzerland and the Netherlands. Trials are currently been carried out in Germany and in the UK on a smaller scale. All are said to be great sucesses and makes it easier for addicts to control their addiction.Drugs on the streets are of the worse quality with many other ingrediants which harm people more than the drug itself.I am not in favour of selling herion in shops, I merely think that it should be prescribed to addicts by doctors. It it much safer for the addict, cuts down drug-related crime (i.e robbery and such).There is no reason to think drug dealing would continue while Herion is prescribed.We'd then see a situation where the French (and no doubt other countries) would enforce ridiculously tough controls against people travelling from the UK and Ireland due to the availability of drugs - exactly as HMRC does to people arriving from Amsterdam.I don't know anything about this but free movement of people will be retained between EU member states.It wouldn't hurt to prescribe hard drugs to people on an rehabilition course where they cannot distribute the drugs to others - but that needs to be met with a huge increase in spending.No, it wouldn'tPrescribed herion probably should be taken in special herion centres, like methadone usually is.A question, though.What happens when the smackhead who's been buying legal heroin can't afford to get any? Are you seriously suggesting that the taxpayer should be paying for someone to get out of their face on drugs? That would be a vote winner, definitely...Prescription charges? I am not aware what usually happens when someone cannot afford to pay for their prescription. The cost for the taxpayer is much greater with the organised crime by drug gangs and oppertunist crime by addicts.We must face the facts that availablity of guns is related to drugs and until we do something about drugs the guns wont disappear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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