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Dan G

DIY crust/grind etc?

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MMW aren't a DIY band obviously. For a start we use our mummy and daddy's money towards buying onto every gig going. I also don't even play my own guitar, someone does it for me. We also never drive to our own gigs. Someone does that for us to. We also don't finance our own recordings etc etc etc

However what IS DIY when it comes to music? If paying for an advert for your band is sucking corporate cock, then what isn't?

For instance, how does a band fund they're own equipment, if they are so called 'DIY' that is?

Stealing? Make it all themselves? I'd guess they probably whip out their cheque book and PAY for it actually...

How does a DIY band get their message spread to the world their own way?

The internet? Phone calls? Postage? (stamps) Flyers?

How are they all funded I wonder.... hmmm. Last time I checked none of that was free.

How does a DIY band practise? I wonder if jake the ape's band practises in Captain Tom's etc or if he practises in his house? Tom's ain't free y'know and I'm sure whoever owns the house doesn't get it gratis either...

How does a DIY band record?

Argos Kareoke machine with one Mic in the middle of a room? Granted, it SOUNDS like that but I'm sure this isn't how it is done.

I reckon they BUY their own equipment maybe? Or perhaps pay for a studio. Maybe borrow someone's 4-tracker... although that would mean dealing with someone who isn't DIY cos they ACTUALLY paid for something.

How does a DIY band get to their next gig?

Taxi? Bus? A Car maybe... walking would be the best DIY option in my opinion but I doubt that happens what with all the equipment to carry etc...

I could go on and on, but I am boring myself let alone anyone who took the time to read the above. But please Jake, before you open your banana loving gob, please think with that tiny simian brain of yours what you are actually saying before you mash it on your keyboard with your hairy flea infested palms.

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i'll give it less than an hour before this thread is closed. any takers?

It's like Oasis v. Blur in the GC Guide rather than the NME.

Or Mods v. Rockers at Torry Battery rather than Brighton Beach.

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i'll give it less than an hour before this thread is closed. any takers?

It would be a shame, it's got potential for some good discussion which is why I haven't closed it already for Dan's bit at the end. And I know that it's basically a direct response to the attack Jake made on MMW, it's a shame Dan's stooped to insults as well. Kind of waters down the point I feel.

We'll be keeping an eye on this one anyway. Just keep it civil guys.

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Good points raised (although I too am "corporate" according to Jake). Where is that line? And what difference does it make if it is crossed? Are there degrees of selling out? (Signing to Rough Trade OK, advert for McDonalds not?)

Jake talks about "no short cuts" - short cuts to where? It all depends what you're aiming for,and MMw are looking for more that palying basements for their career, whereas Jakes lot may be happy with that and the cred it brings - no disrespect intended.

Yes, Jakes comments were short sighted and (IMHO) elitist, but his take on what determines success is different to MMW. I respect bands who work hard and don't compromise - MMW work harder than most (all?) Aberdeen bands, and haven't compromised their sound one iota. Yes, its a "cool" style at present, but they ALL love it, and don't need your (or anyone elses) approval.

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I'm pretty sure that DIY (Do It Yourself) refers to taking your own initiatives and...doing things for yourself, rather than being sulf-sufficient, which is what this thread kinda implies. eg - I guess that booking your own tour would be DIY, rather than building venues up and down the country to play in.

Of course, it doesn't really matter one bit if you're "DIY" or not, if you're making the music that you want to make without any interference from outside parties.

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For a more accurate representation of DIY in action...see Fugazi/Dischord Records.....

[Posted by 194.223.6.55. This is added while posting a message to avoid misuse of WebWarper: see http://webwarper.net/han Example of using WebWarper: http://webwarper.net/ww/www.aberdeen-music.com/forums/showthread.php?p=445708&*#post445708 ]

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Of course' date=' it doesn't really matter one bit if you're "DIY" or not, if you're making the music that you want to make without any interference from outside parties.[/quote']

amen brother! goddamn!

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Guest Page 99
I'm pretty sure that DIY (Do It Yourself) refers to taking your own initiatives and...doing things for yourself' date=' rather than being sulf-sufficient, which is what this thread kinda implies. eg - I guess that booking your own tour would be DIY, rather than building venues up and down the country to play in.

Of course, it doesn't really matter one bit if you're "DIY" or not, if you're making the music that you want to make without any interference from outside parties.[/quote']

Yup, sums up my attitude totaly.

All types of music can be D.I.Y. it's not some elitist thing consigned to the hardcore scene, and if it is seen as that it bloody well shouldn't be.

It's just all about doing what you want to do, making the music you want to, playing however you like, putting on what shows you like, just so long as you're not opening yourself to exploitation.

But then again, I've probibly not been involved long enough to comment.

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For a more accurate representation of DIY in action...see Fugazi/Dischord Records.....

[Posted by 194.223.6.55. This is added while posting a message to avoid misuse of WebWarper: see http://webwarper.net/han Example of using WebWarper: http://webwarper.net/ww/www.aberdeen-music.com/forums/showthread.php?p=445708&*#post445708 ]

thing is though, even dischord have a distribution company.

tape trading and the global diy scene that spike and filthpact et all play in is probably more strict diy but again it's all relative to what you want to do really. i mean dischord are diy but only to an extent.

diy is like all good ideas that have become more like a religion(straight edge, diy, christianity that kinda thing). people look to hard at those who divert from the script rather than focussing on the sense of community and musical spirit that all these bands share and working from that. i mean everyones in it for the same fucking reasons at the end of the day and that's cause everyone just wants to make music they believe in. just cause someone's idea of promoting that is to take out an advert in kerrang and another's idea is to get on a hometaped compilation put out in the czech republic doesn't mean everyone has to fight about who's idea is best. they're all just ideas. get over it.

i don't see how paying for something is a shortcut and i don't see deliberately misinterpretating the diy ethic is going to acheive anything either. none of the bands in aberdeen can afford to quit their dayjobs yet and are knowhere near that stage so everyone, and i mean EVERYONE is at exactly the same stage.

interestingly enough the people in aberdeen who have most renown in aberdeen don't end up in these shitty arguments do they? you don't see alan cynic(playing a festival in new york, been on radio there, on compilations round the world) resorting to playground squabling of this type and you don't get anyone from hookers green(you can actually buy their cd in the shops folks) mocking the bands they don't get on with for not being as successful.

both sides should get overthemselves and get on with it. its' embarrassing if nothing else. well done to my minds weapon but enough is enough surely.

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It would be a shame' date=' it's got potential for some good discussion which is why I haven't closed it already for Dan's bit at the end. And I know that it's basically a direct response to the attack Jake made on MMW, it's a shame Dan's stooped to insults as well. Kind of waters down the point I feel.

We'll be keeping an eye on this one anyway. Just keep it civil guys.[/quote']

Yes this WAS a direct response and I agree with you that it is a shame I have stooped that low.

Jakes comment just royally insulted the hard work and effort I (and the other guys) put into the band, and further more his ill founded judgements got a thread closed, that in some way acknowledged a small fraction of the work we put in!

I'm sure people will read this post and my one above and think I am a complete cunt, and fair enough - but jamesy's one TINY little dig (it's not like he's recieved the odd one himself...) leads to all that bullshit.

Sorry, but it made me feel better by being a dick on the internet :D

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Yes this WAS a direct response and I agree with you that it is a shame I have stooped that low.

Jakes comment just royally insulted the hard work and effort I (and the other guys) put into the band' date=' and further more his ill founded judgements got a thread closed, that in some way acknowledged a small fraction of the work we put in!

I'm sure people will read this post and my one above and think I am a complete cunt, but jamesy's one TINY little dig (it's not like he's recieved the odd one himself...) leads to all that bullshit.

Sorry, but it made me feel better being a dick on the internet :D[/quote']

Just out of interest, what was the thread that got closed, I'm curious to see what Jake had said to make you respond in such a way...

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Filthpact sold out and developed crack habits months ago :p

haha, i though thurizas was on that YEARS ago... :D

just to let you know Dave, my rant actually had NOTHING to do with DIY bands, and the hard work bands like yourselves put in. I think its awesome what you guys have done.

I just feel damn insulted that people like Jake (and Gregor) accuse us of putting in no work at all and having everything laid out on a plate due to cash, which couldn't be further from the truth (we are all skint anyway...)

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thing is though' date=' even dischord have a distribution company.[/quote']

Isn't that with Southern Records? Another example of DIY in action (as opposed to DIY being 500 shitty sounding 7" records with photocopied covers stuck under someones bed cos no one wants to buy them)

johnloder.jpg

[Posted by 194.223.6.55. This is added while posting a message to avoid misuse of WebWarper: see http://webwarper.net/han Example of using WebWarper: http://webwarper.net/ww/www.aberdeen-music.com/forums/showthread.php?p=445749&*#post445749 ]

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haha' date=' i though thurizas was on that YEARS ago... :D

just to let you know Dave, my rant actually had NOTHING to do with DIY bands, and the hard work bands like yourselves put in. I think its awesome what you guys have done.

I just feel damn insulted that people like Jake (and Gregor) accuse us of putting in no work at all and having everything laid out on a plate due to cash, which couldn't be further from the truth (we are all skint anyway...)[/quote']

Don't worry about it all mate, whilst the music may not be to my current tastes its plain for all to see the work you lot have put in over the past 2 years, good luck with the gig.

Dave

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hmm I think Gregors comments were out of line but I dunno bout Jakes. Not saying I completely agree but erm.. I don't see the point in all this arguing between Spike and MMW. We're different bands with different ideals and what works for you is totally different to us but I don't see a problem with that. Think everyone should just agree to disagree. Or something like that...

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Isn't that with Southern Records? Another example of DIY in action (as opposed to DIY being 500 shitty sounding 7" records with photocopied covers stuck under someones bed cos no one wants to buy them)

johnloder.jpg

[Posted by 194.223.6.55. This is added while posting a message to avoid misuse of WebWarper: see http://webwarper.net/han Example of using WebWarper: http://webwarper.net/ww/www.aberdeen-music.com/forums/showthread.php?p=445749&*#post445749 ]

yea it is. and i was sad to read that john loder had died earlier today(in that i read it earlier today, he died late summer). although ian mackaye and john loder did it themselves perhaps that was more out of necessity than a conscious desicion. ian mackaye does it all himself cause he's a workaholic who didn't see the logic in paying people to do things like drive the van particularly when he doesn't drink or whatever.

i think diy works best when you look at it as a model like with dischord and southern. they exist as a community and perhaps training centre to show bands how to exist and be self sufficient in an industry designed to bleed money from bands. they can't encourage complete diy cause they still have to run as businesses but they run them in such a way that it is good to have other labels cropping up and working with each other for the good of them all and not just one group. southern succeeds everyone succeeds. i wasn't slagging dischord or belittling what they do, merely pointing out the ridiculousness of diy as gospel. it becomes so inflexible if you set out rules rather than some good ideas.

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Guest Gregor Ascension
hmm I think Gregors comments were out of line but I dunno bout Jakes. Not saying I completely agree but erm.. I don't see the point in all this arguing between Spike and MMW. We're different bands with different ideals and what works for you is totally different to us but I don't see a problem with that. Think everyone should just agree to disagree. Or something like that...

i think you will find each comment i made was a direct response to a personal attack.

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To be honest, I will let you and Jake discuss this. Personally, I have the odd dig at Jamesy but have never once been seriously taking the piss, you know that Dan ;) If there wasnt a bit of MMW bashing and Jamesy winding the world would be a quiet place. As for Jake well, it will be interesting to hear what he has to say. MMW are doing fine so are Spike but in very different ways.

I agree that this could be an interesting thread regarding what is/isnt DIY etc, hopefully that is what it will be about.

Cheers

Hog the bald diplomat

or as Jamesy once stated Hog "the wine sipping bastard" :D

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haha' date=' i though thurizas was on that YEARS ago... :D[/quote']dont spell my name wrong, you fucking hippy.

and yeah, Mitch is the only one that smokes crack. The rest of it inject it into our fucking eyes.

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