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I think neil should treat himself, after all he's put a shit load of his own money into running the site, and if the site continues to make money then it can be plough back into the site. Saying that It's probably only making a fiver a year

[Stuart]

I loved the radio when it was going. And you had the chat rooms to speak to the Dj's as you were listening to the radio... Ah, It was great. Bring back the radio!
Or, you know, whatever else is cool. But firsty Neil, go out and drink alot of cider with the sponsors money!

[Spoonie]

i'm not entirely sure of what to spend the money on, but i thought i'd fire in here and say well done to neil and thanks for all the effort you've put in. for people like myself who have a great interest in the aberdeen scene but can't find the time to make it up north that often, it's a real pleasure to have access to a facility like this which keeps me in touch. i'm not gonna give heaps of chat about the days of the aubl and fudgenet board on bravenet and how far we've come since then, but it really is a tremendous resource for both information and entertainment. well done!

also, you should maybe hold onto the money and let it accumulate for a bit, just in case anything unexpected comes up. alternatively, it was my birthday a week back and i don't remember you gettnig me anything, so perhaps you could rectify that now

spoons
/x

[psydoll]

Originally Posted by jsmith

aberdeen music radio sounds like a silly idea, dodgy sounding demos of crap local bands doesnt inspire me at all.

Aye steady on min.

We're nae talking about playing Cuts demo tracks throughout all the shows.

[chilli]

Originally Posted by Neil

This is nothing short of an insult to aberdeen-music.com's current sponsors and myself. This is maybe my fault for not making it more obvious but the prices stated in the FAQ are meant more as a guideline rather than the prices everyone must pay. As many of the sponsors know, I'm more than prepared to cater for their personal circumstances and lower the sponsorship rate in order to agree on a deal - they just have to ask. I don't think the likes of Arkade Projects, Moshulu and the GFN? guys, for example, would like to be referred to as promoters or venues that "screw" people over in order to pay aberdeen-music.com sponsorship money. They pay what they can in order to benefit from aberdeen-music.com and in turn attract even more people to the web site. Sponsorship should be mutually benefiting otherwise there is no point in sponsoring the web site.

My comments were trying to be constructive, with a touch of irony, sorry if you feel I have insulted your excellent operation etc, Aberdeen Music is a fantastic resource centre for NE Scotland music & we'd be lost without it. The fact is as a promotor, we would also love to say we are @ a break even situation. All we want to do is attact artists to Aberdeen who nomally don't come here & who we want to see ourselves, plus if we can promote local artists who are trying to do something which in our opinion is interesting, then great stuff. We are music enthusiasts, who are independent promotors & not a commercial operation. As you probably remember I did ask for a quote to be a sponsor about a year ago, but was put off due to the cost, which we couldn't afford. Didn't realise there was flexibility to these costs.

[Cloud]

Originally Posted by Neil

I don't think the likes of Arkade Projects, Moshulu and the GFN? guys, for example, would like to be referred to as promoters or venues that "screw" people over in order to pay aberdeen-music.com sponsorship money.

Considering it costs peanuts in reality to have a forum, it works out as a matter of pence for each person coming to our gigs to pay for the forum - I can't be bothered to do the exact maths, but the numbers involved per person are so insigificant that it wouldn't change anything about the gig prices - really, the difference involved would mean paying an extra pound to every local band that plays..in reality, what's going to help more, paying them that extra pound, or paying for the forum on here?

I know for a fact that we've never screwed anyone locally, so I do take offence at being referred to as such. If we've ever paid under the going rate for local acts, I've always explained why - and we've never "underpaid" just to pay for our forum. Considering we only now have one regular "prime" spot a month in a venue, I'd say we do pretty good not ripping anyone off while saving a little bit each time for a rainy day.

As for what I'd like to see on the website :

<promoter hat> I'd like to see a better way of advertising gigs without using the forums - perhaps a page where people could click to look at all the gigs on in a certain month. Ideally, it would be set up so people could add gigs - perhaps people who have paid to sponsor the place could automatically add gigs as a privilege, whereas anyone who hasn't would need them to be approved by a moderator first? I find the biggest problem at the minute is that there's not one page I can bookmark to immediately see what's on in a given month - the calendar is too..awkward? </promoter hat>

<personal hat> The radio is a great idea, provided there's no issues with copyright and suchlike. I can think of various things that it could be used for - instead of just music, why couldn't things like interviews be broadcast with local people?

In fact, considering you want to move away from being "about the forums" and more of a resource, what about having a page with comprensive information about all the parts of the "scene" - as it stands, there's not a place where people can learn all about the individual aspects of venues/promoters/etc - so information pages combined with interviews with people (text, that is) could be very fascinating to see.

[huntedbyafreak]

Originally Posted by jester1470

therefore you make more money allowing you to put on the gigs you want. You saound likje your doing it out of thed goodness of your heart and getting nothing in return,

absolute fool!

i doubt very much if interesting music break even, never mind make money!! for someone who goes on about how much of a hero you are in the music industry you have embarrased yourself!

go and check out the special acts that they bring to aberdeen! see the handful of loyal punters who go to be amazed each week! then ask mike or graeme how much door money they took and how much the band cost! they will almost certainly tell you that they lost money but they dont care because there were 30 people who walked away truly delighted!

that is what music is about, that is what being a promoter is about!!! i think you have been hanigng around your mate cloud too much recently, he too seems only interested in making money or pulling "punters" through the door when it comes to music

go take a look at yourself!

[huntedbyafreak]

Originally Posted by Cloud

Considering it costs peanuts in reality to have a forum, it works out as a matter of pence for each person coming to our gigs to pay for the forum - I can't be bothered to do the exact maths, but the numbers involved per person are so insigificant that it wouldn't change anything about the gig prices - really, the difference involved would mean paying an extra pound to every local band that plays..in reality, what's going to help more, paying them that extra pound, or paying for the forum on here?

I know for a fact that we've never screwed anyone locally, so I do take offence at being referred to as such. If we've ever paid under the going rate for local acts, I've always explained why - and we've never "underpaid" just to pay for our forum. Considering we only now have one regular "prime" spot a month in a venue, I'd say we do pretty good not ripping anyone off while saving a little bit each time for a rainy day.

As for what I'd like to see on the website :

<promoter hat> I'd like to see a better way of advertising gigs without using the forums - perhaps a page where people could click to look at all the gigs on in a certain month. Ideally, it would be set up so people could add gigs - perhaps people who have paid to sponsor the place could automatically add gigs as a privilege, whereas anyone who hasn't would need them to be approved by a moderator first? I find the biggest problem at the minute is that there's not one page I can bookmark to immediately see what's on in a given month - the calendar is too..awkward? </promoter hat>

<personal hat> The radio is a great idea, provided there's no issues with copyright and suchlike. I can think of various things that it could be used for - instead of just music, why couldn't things like interviews be broadcast with local people?

In fact, considering you want to move away from being "about the forums" and more of a resource, what about having a page with comprensive information about all the parts of the "scene" - as it stands, there's not a place where people can learn all about the individual aspects of venues/promoters/etc - so information pages combined with interviews with people (text, that is) could be very fascinating to see.

you??promoter?? dont make me laugh! you have screwed many people locally, with the money you charge for some of your, quite frankly, awful gigs that you put on!!

there is a difference between a promoter, and somebody who puts on gigs, you are just as bad as your mate paul stewart

[Cloud]

go and check out the special acts that they bring to aberdeen! see the handful of loyal punters who go to be amazed each week! then ask mike or graeme how much door money they took and how much the band cost! they will almost certainly tell you that they lost money but they dont care because there were 30 people who walked away truly delighted!

Does it matter if they made money or not? If they can afford to keep going, that's all that matters. How they keep going is of no relevance whatsoever - I assume if they're losing money, they must have another source of income that lets them carry on - which is fine by me.

But.

that is what music is about, that is what being a promoter is about!!! i think you have been hanigng around your mate cloud too much recently, he too seems only interested in making money or pulling "punters" through the door when it comes to music

Making money? Pulling punters? Well..in case it's escaped your attention, venues are businesses too. Not one venue we use charges us the "real" cost of putting on a gig - so we have to get as many people through the door so that they'll make some of it back on the bar, it doesn't suit *anyone* to have low gig attendances. If the gig is being paid for in full (bar costs, sound engineer costs, the lot), then it doesn't matter, but commercial reality means you have to go for bringing as many people through the door so the venue doesn't lose out.

you??promoter?? dont make me laugh! you have screwed many people locally, with the money you charge for some of your, quite frankly, awful gigs that you put on!!

Money we charge? Would you like an in depth explanation of how the only money we have saved from gigs is to pay for future gigs that might not be a success? That 50p extra you might pay on the door will pay for something else down the line - considering none of us can afford to put money into putting on gigs, what can we do?

there is a difference between a promoter, and somebody who puts on gigs, you are just as bad as your mate paul stewart

As bad as Paul? hmmmm..I'll let other people be the judge of that - but I've heard a lot of praise from people who appreciate us trying to put on bigger gigs without fleecing people.

As for what we do - we lose money on some gigs, we make money on some others, and the end result is that we break even. Everyone wins - but personally, it gives me far more satisfaction to see a busy venue and to be able to pay everyone well and to be able to see that the venue in question has broken even than it does to see the venue empty and out of pocket and the bands going home with a few quid.

If you want to donate a few quid to us so we can drop prices for a gig, please feel free.

Oh and as for us being as bad as Paul? None of us take a penny from putting on gigs, it's a non profit venture, with all proceeds being reinvested to bring other bands up here. Slightly different story, don't you think?

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Frosty Jack

A radio station sounds like a great idea, but would it be purely for playing unsigned bands, demos etc? If you're streaming copyrighted tracks ie commercial cds, there may be licensing requirements if you're planning on keeping this site legal...

Thanks for the link Frosty. Most interesting as the last time we did the radio station we did indeed play commercial music as well local acts and at the time MCPS nor PRS had any kind of licensing offering in place for online radio stations. Glad to see that appears to have been addressed now. I've fired off an e-mail to them to see what kind of licence aberdeen-music.com might need.

Originally Posted by chilli

My comments were trying to be constructive, with a touch of irony, sorry if you feel I have insulted your excellent operation etc, Aberdeen Music is a fantastic resource centre for NE Scotland music & we'd be lost without it. The fact is as a promotor, we would also love to say we are @ a break even situation. All we want to do is attact artists to Aberdeen who nomally don't come here & who we want to see ourselves, plus if we can promote local artists who are trying to do something which in our opinion is interesting, then great stuff. We are music enthusiasts, who are independent promotors & not a commercial operation. As you probably remember I did ask for a quote to be a sponsor about a year ago, but was put off due to the cost, which we couldn't afford. Didn't realise there was flexibility to these costs.

Fair enough. I'll update the FAQ article to make the fact that there is flexibility in the sponsorship rates more explicit.

I do recall you contacted me but I can't remember what you asked for nor how much I quoted you! Please feel free to PM me again and let me know what you would like to have (e.g. calendar, forum, ad banners etc) and we can try and get something sorted. The sponsorship rates are changed quite frequently and I'm always trying to be as flexible as possible so I might be able to quote you a lower rate this time round. Please just let me know if you are interested because I'm always keen to get local promoters and venues more involved with the web site if I can.