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[Stripey]

Originally Posted by Swingin' Ryan

Yes I'm fully aware that the keyboard is sample based, but your earlier comments gave the impression you were saying that sample and electronically based music was in some was intelectually superior to real instruments and guitar bands nowadays.

So how is me using a midi keyboard to play and record stuff, any different from you using your sample based digital keyboard? At least I go to the effort of actually creating synth patches from scratch!
I'm not saying that there is some kind of intellectual superiority about this - just far greater scope for creativity because a far greater range of sounds, automation and treatments to those sounds are possible, a lot of which simply couldn't feasibly be recreated in a live situation.

[Swingin' Ryan]

Originally Posted by Stripey

So how is me using a midi keyboard to play and record stuff, any different from you using your sample based digital keyboard? At least I go to the effort of actually creating synth patches from scratch!

I don't think there's any difference at all, and I'm not saying that me using a digital keyboard is superior to your use of a midi keyboard. I'm just emphasising that, in my opinion, you cannot really compare someone playing a piece on a piano or a guitar to someone fixing together samples on a computer.

The fact your saying that the music you make could not be recreated live makes me think that inputing the sounds does not require as much skill or talent as it would to play the music on conventional instruments. I'll admit my knowledge of creating music electronically is pretty much reserved to some basic drum programming and recording guitars through a digital 8-track, so there may be a lot more musical knowledge required for what you do than I'm giving you credit for, I just feel a lot of electronic music seems to be based more in computer skills than musical knowledge.

[Stripey]

Originally Posted by Swingin' Ryan

I don't think there's any difference at all, and I'm not saying that me using a digital keyboard is superior to your use of a midi keyboard. I'm just emphasising that, in my opinion, you cannot really compare someone playing a piece on a piano or a guitar to someone fixing together samples on a computer.

The fact your saying that the music you make could not be recreated live makes me think that inputing the sounds does not require as much skill or talent as it would to play the music on conventional instruments. I'll admit my knowledge of creating music electronically is pretty much reserved to some basic drum programming and recording guitars through a digital 8-track, so there may be a lot more musical knowledge required for what you do than I'm giving you credit for, I just feel a lot of electronic music seems to be based more in computer skills than musical knowledge.

Forget the idea of someone "fixing together samples", that's not what it's about atall in this day and age.
What makes you think inputting the parts into a digital composition requires any less skill or talent? Most people use keyboards to do it, as far as I'm aware that's a pretty conventional instrument. As I said earlier people also record parts they play on guitar or sing or use an electronic drum kit, a real drum kit, or use a fucking oboe or whatever else they feel like. You still have to actually play, or if you want to, draw in the individual notes by hand.
Computer skills don't come into it atall.

[Swingin' Ryan]

So if conventional instruments are used to input sound in digital recording, why does it have greater scope for creativity? Is it purely the ability to then manipulate these sounds, as I've heard a lot of people get a vast range of noises out of a guitar (Tom Morello for example, has guitar parts which sound very much like synths, purely from using effects pedals), he also has the benefit of being able to play these live. I know you probably don't see the ability to play live as a benefit, but he still has the option.

[milner]

can any of you show me a piece of electronicaly made music that has as much feeling in as this does?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXYjEMTQRm0

i very much doubt it, and to me thats why i far preferr music performed on actual instruments rather than that created on a pc or how ever it is done.

[Stripey]

Originally Posted by milner

can any of you show me a piece of electronicaly made music that has as much feeling in as this does?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXYjEMTQRm0

i very much doubt it, and to me thats why i far preferr music performed on actual instruments rather than that created on a pc or how ever it is done.

That just leaves me cold, it's archaic. Even the guy playing it is old, and it became irritating after about 2 mins or so. The sound of a distorted electric guitar just bores the shit out of me, no matter how expressive the playing is.
I've got reams of electronic music that is far more interesting, subtle and nuanced, far more cleverly executed, far more unique, far more expressive, far more emotional, to the extent that a lot of it has an almost cinematic quality to it.
If you think electronic music is devoid of feeling, if your only experience of it is house/techno/drumnbass/etc then yer missing out on a great deal.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Gap5...=robot%20flute

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7dLBt...=robot%20flute

Originally Posted by Stripey

That just leaves me cold, it's archaic. Even the guy playing it is old, and it became irritating after about 2 mins or so. The sound of a distorted electric guitar just bores the shit out of me, no matter how expressive the playing is.

You KnOb! There's distorted guitar on my tunes, pfft, cheers STRIPEY!!!

[Stripey]

Originally Posted by Swingin' Ryan

So if conventional instruments are used to input sound in digital recording, why does it have greater scope for creativity? Is it purely the ability to then manipulate these sounds, as I've heard a lot of people get a vast range of noises out of a guitar (Tom Morello for example, has guitar parts which sound very much like synths, purely from using effects pedals), he also has the benefit of being able to play these live. I know you probably don't see the ability to play live as a benefit, but he still has the option.

Conventional instruments aren't always used, the key point is flexibility. And yes, the manipulation of sound "offline" offers a huge potential, which you can't reproduce with pedals.
If your only experience of digital equipment is a drum machine and an 8track, I'm not surprised you don't really understand how a modern digital studio works.
In terms of creativity, remember the fact that you also have complete and total control over the whole song, i.e you are the bass player, the keys player, the singer, the drummer, whatever you want. If you like working on your own you have more opportunity to create what you yourself really want to create.

[Stripey]

Originally Posted by MKII

You KnOb! There's distorted guitar on my tunes, pfft, cheers STRIPEY!!!

fuck I'll have to delete them from my playlist now